What was in the 5 A4 page witness statement of Andrew Roberts (Wirral Council) about a Freedom of Information request for the minutes of a meeting of the Headteachers’ and Teachers’ Joint Consultative Committee (EA/2016/0033)?

What was in the 5 A4 page witness statement of Andrew Roberts (Wirral Council) about a Freedom of Information request for the minutes of a meeting of the Headteachers’ and Teachers’ Joint Consultative Committee (EA/2016/0033)?                                               At the outset I will make four declarations of interests. 1) I am the Appellant in this case (EA/2016/0033). … Continue reading “What was in the 5 A4 page witness statement of Andrew Roberts (Wirral Council) about a Freedom of Information request for the minutes of a meeting of the Headteachers’ and Teachers’ Joint Consultative Committee (EA/2016/0033)?”

What was in the 5 A4 page witness statement of Andrew Roberts (Wirral Council) about a Freedom of Information request for the minutes of a meeting of the Headteachers’ and Teachers’ Joint Consultative Committee (EA/2016/0033)?

                                             

At the outset I will make four declarations of interests.

1) I am the Appellant in this case (EA/2016/0033).
2) My wife was my McKenzie Friend in case EA/2016/0033.
3) I made the original Freedom of Information request on the 29th March 2013.
4) I am referred to by name (Mr. Brace) in paragraphs 1, 4 and 5 of the witness statement of Andrew Roberts.

This continues from an earlier blog post headlined What were the 6 A4 pages of partially redacted minutes of a Headteachers’/Teachers’ Joint Consultative Committee meeting and the name of a LGA Associate Tutor that Wirral Council disclosed voluntarily in response to a First Tier-Tribunal (General Regulatory chamber) hearing (case number EA/2016/0033) about a Freedom of Information request first made in March 2013?.

Line breaks are indicated by a double horizontal line break. A picture of Andrew Roberts at a meeting of Wirral Council’s Schools Forum from the 3rd December 2014 is below so people reading know who I’m referring to. I have included his signature at the end of the witness statement as an image.

I have added a links from his witness statement below to decision notice FS50596346 referred to in paragraph 1 of his witness statement as this has been published on ICO’s website. I also link to the Freedom of Information Act 2000 also referred to in paragraph 1.

Where paragraphs cross over multiple page I have added the paragraph number on the second page to preserve formatting and to aid with comprehension.

The witness statement of Andrew Roberts was sent to me by post to the incorrect address (Wirral Council decided to delete the road and property number) for service (recorded signed for mail) by Wirral Council on 31st May 2016. It was received by myself on the 2nd June 2016.

Andrew Roberts at a public meeting of Wirral Council's Schools Forum 3rd December 2014
Andrew Roberts at a public meeting of Wirral Council’s Schools Forum 3rd December 2014

Continue reading “What was in the 5 A4 page witness statement of Andrew Roberts (Wirral Council) about a Freedom of Information request for the minutes of a meeting of the Headteachers’ and Teachers’ Joint Consultative Committee (EA/2016/0033)?”

Time of hearing for EA/2016/0033 changed from 10.00 am to 10.15 am

Time of hearing for EA/2016/0033 changed from 10.00 am to 10.15 am

                                

Liverpool Civil & Family Court, Vernon Street, Liverpool, L2 2BX (the venue for the upcoming First-Tier Tribunal case EA/2016/0033)
Liverpool Civil & Family Court, Vernon Street, Liverpool, L2 2BX (the venue for the upcoming First-Tier Tribunal case EA/2016/0033)

First a declaration of interest, as I am the Appellant in the First-Tier Tribunal (Information Rights) case EA/2016/0033. The two respondents are the Information Commissioner’s Office and Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council.

I received notification from the Tribunal yesterday that the time for this hearing has been changed. It has been altered by fifteen minutes.

The original date and time was:

10.00 am 16th June 2016

The new date and time is (I have underlined the change for emphasis):

10.15 am 16th June 2016

The venue remains unchanged and is still

3rd Floor (Tribunals Service),
Liverpool Civil and Family Court
35 Vernon Street
Liverpool
Merseyside
L2 2BX

As the matter is now sub judice, unfortunately for legal reasons I will have to turn comments off on this post.

If you click on any of the buttons below, you’ll be doing me a favour by sharing this article with other people.

Would you like to see what 19 pages of invoices paid by Merseytravel looks like for Smartcare, project management, police community support officer costs, the Stop Hate Line service, temporary closure of a bus interchange, bus subsidy, a temporary traffic regulation order, EPI sign licence, scanning and flexible hours annual hours consultancy?

Would you like to see what 19 pages of invoices paid by Merseytravel looks like for Smartcare, project management, police community support officer costs, the Stop Hate Line service, temporary closure of a bus interchange, bus subsidy, a temporary traffic regulation order, EPI sign licence, scanning and flexible hours annual hours consultancy?

                                                                

Below is an index page for month one and some of the invoices I requested to inspect at Merseytravel last year (financial year 2014/15) during the period each year when citizens can inspect matters such as invoices. The legal right to do this is outlined in s.15 Audit Commission Act. Each invoice is connected to a payment made by Merseytravel (or to give it its formal name the Merseyside Passenger Transport Executive).

The thumbnails below are invoices for payments to ECEBS Ltd (£1,500), Weston-Projects Limited (£4,504.92), British Transport Police (£13,698.87), Police and Crime Commissioner for Merseyside (£39,213.72), Stop Hate UK (£3,500), Sefton Metropolitan Borough Council (£650), Your Travel Borough Wide Ltd (£3,538.46), Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council (£903), Trapeze Group (UK) Limited (£6,100), Service Point UK Ltd (£3,500) and Crown Computing Limited (£1,000 + £1,125.40 + £1,500). All figures are exclusive of VAT.

These invoices relate to the first 13 lines on the index page.

Due to small text size on some of the invoices, it means that the text on some of the thumbnails will be difficult to read or not readable. However the thumbnail images of the invoice below are each linked to a high-resolution image. If you want to view at the original resolution just click on the image.

The invoice from Wirral Council is for £903 for "COSTS IN RESPECT OF TEMPORARY TRAFFIC REGULATION ORDER. WOODSIDE BUS STATION, BIRKENHEAD. ORDER NUMBER 88003977. REF: JESSICA".

JESSICA is an acronym which stands for Joint European Support for Sustainable Investment in City Areas. Merseytravel run Woodside Bus Station which is outside Woodside Ferry Terminal.

Merseytravel 2014 2015 audit Month 1 index page ECEBS Ltd to MERSEYRAIL ELECTRICS 2002 thumbnail
Merseytravel 2014 2015 audit Month 1 index page ECEBS Ltd to MERSEYRAIL ELECTRICS 2002 thumbnail

Invoices
Month 1
Name
ECEBS LTD
WESTON-PROJECTS LIMITED
BRITISH TRANSPORT POLICE
POLICE AND CRIME COMMISSIONER FOR MERSEYSIDE
STOP HATE UK
SEFTON M B C
YOUR TRAVEL BOROUGH WIDE LTD
WIRRAL BOROUGH COUNCIL
TRAPEZE GROUP (UK) LTD
SERVICE POINT UK LTD
CROWN COMPUTING LIMITED
CROWN COMPUTING LIMITED
CROWN COMPUTING LIMITED
LOCAL SOLUTIONS
FOURPOINT MAPPING
OPTEVIA LIMITED
OPTEVIA LIMITED
BIKERIGHT
BIKERIGHT
FOURPOINT MAPPING
FOURPOINT MAPPING
OEFICEXPRESS
TRUEFORM ENGINEERING LTD
KENYON FRASER
KENYON FRASER
NATIONAL QUALITY ASSURANCE LTD
MOTT MACDONALD LTD
MOTT MACDONALD LTD
OFFICEXPRESS
APPIUS INTERNATIONAL LTD
ARTOPIA
LIVERPOOL CITY COUNCIL
VOCUS UK LTD
MOTT MACDONALD LTD
SEFTON M B C
BIRCHAM DYSON BELL
FACELIFT (GB) LTD
FACELIFT (GB) LTD
QA LTD
QA LTD
QA LTD
COUNSELLING SOLUTIONS NORTHWEST
WEIGHTMANS LLP
BIRCHAM DYSON BELL
ALLAN PILCH & CO
DAVIES WALLIS FOYSTER
XEROX UK LTD
HAYS INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY
HAYS INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY
HAYS INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY
HAYS INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY
VEALE WASBROUGH VIZARDS
RSTCS LTD
BIRCHAM DYSON BELL
NEXUS
DLA PIPER UK LLP
MERSEYRAIL ELECTRICS 2002 LTD

Continue reading “Would you like to see what 19 pages of invoices paid by Merseytravel looks like for Smartcare, project management, police community support officer costs, the Stop Hate Line service, temporary closure of a bus interchange, bus subsidy, a temporary traffic regulation order, EPI sign licence, scanning and flexible hours annual hours consultancy?”

After 2 years, 10 months and 3 ICO decision notices will Wirral Council finally provide a response to a FOI request about councillors?

After 2 years, 10 months and 3 ICO decision notices will Wirral Council finally provide a response to a FOI request about councillors?

                                                                            

ICO Information Commissioner's Office logo
ICO Information Commissioner’s Office logo

Last week I received another decision notice from the Information Commissioner’s Office through the post about this freedom of information act request I made to Wirral Council on the 29th March 2013.

Yes it’s now 2016, but this request has already been the subject of decision notice FS50509081 (dated 8th September 2014) (9 pages) and decision notice FS50569254 (dated 29th July 2015) (13 pages).

This decision (decision notice FS50596346) dated the 25th January 2016 is 11 pages long.

Frankly, after two years and ten months of arguing over this request I doubt (although this is just my opinion) that either Wirral Council will want to appeal the decision to the First-tier Tribunal (Information Rights). Although one can never quite tell with Wirral Council.

Out of the remaining four parts to this request, Wirral Council released the minutes of the Safeguarding Reference Group meeting of the 19th April 2011 a fortnight before the decision notice is dated.

So the decision notice relates to minutes of a meeting of the Headteachers and Teachers Joint Consultative Committee, minutes of a meeting of the Members’ (Members’ means councillors) Training Steering Group and minutes of a meeting of the Members’ Equipment Steering Group.

All these committees met behind closed doors and had councillors appointed to them.

The information in the minutes of the meetings of the last two groups are about training of councillors, use of electronic equipment, developing the Council of the Future, spending, service delivery models and proposals for improvement and potential change.

Surjit Tour made the decisions that releasing this information would be "prejudicial to the effective conduct of public affairs". There’s a long bit of the decision notice that goes into ICO’s assessment of the public interest test. ICO disagrees with Surjit Tour with regards to two out of the three sets of minutes requested. ICO’s view is that the public interest test weighs in favour of disclosure of the minutes of the Members’ Training Steering Group and minutes of the meeting of the Members’ Equipment Steering Group.

They do however agree with Surjit Tour over the minutes of the Headteachers’ and Teacher’s Joint Consultative Committee, although I’ll point out I find their arguments over a "chilling effect" over what was said at a meeting three years ago rather strange!

Below I include a copy of the decision notice (above is a summary). Although it states I didn’t submit public interest arguments, I did in a document marked "reasons for appeal" (in fact I have an email from the case officer referring to it). However the reasons for appeal have seemingly either not been read or ignored by the person writing the decision notice.

The result of the decision notice is that Wirral Council (or I) can appeal the decision within 28 days of the decision notice to the First-tier Tribunal (Information Rights) or if the decision is accepted they have to respond by providing the minutes relating to the meetings of the Members’ Training Steering Group and of the Members’ Equipment Steering Group within 35 days.

A copy of the text of the decision notice is below (although there may be some minor formatting changes between this web version and the print version). Edited on 15/2/2016 The decision notice (FS50593646) has now been published on ICO’s website.


Reference: FS50596346

Freedom of Information Act 2000 (FOIA)

Decision notice

Date: 25 January 2016

Public Authority: Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council
Address: Wallasey Town Hall
Brighton Street
Wallasey
Wirral
CH44 8ED

Complainant: John Brace

Address: Jenmaleo
134 Boundary Road
Bidston
Wirral
CH43 7PH

Decision (including any steps ordered)



1. The complaint concerns a request for the minutes of three separate committee meetings. Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council (‘the Council’) has refused to release this information. The Council says it is exempt under section 36 of the FOIA (prejudice to the effective conduct of public affairs) and that the public interest favours the information being withheld.

2. The Commissioner’s decision is that sections 36(2)(b)(i) and (ii) have been correctly applied to the requested information and that the public interest favours withholding some of the information (item 15). However he finds that the public interest favours releasing the remainder of the information.

3. The Commissioner requires the public authority to take the following step to ensure compliance with the legislation:

1



Reference: FS50596346

4. The public authority must take this step within 35 calendar days of the date of this decision notice. Failure to comply may result in the Commissioner making written certification of this fact to the High Court pursuant to section 54 of the Act and may be dealt with as a contempt of court.

Background


5. The request that is the subject of this notice has been subject to two previous decision notices – FS50509081 and FS50569254. Of relevance to this notice, FS50569254 found that the Council had incorrectly applied section 14(1) (vexatious request) to four parts of the 26 part request. The Commissioner ordered the Council to disclose this information or issue a fresh refusal notice.

Request and response



6. On 29 March 2013, as part of the wider request referred to above, the complainant had written to the Council and requested information in the following terms:

“Please could you provide minutes of the previous meetings of the following committees…
… 15. Headteachers and Teachers JCC
18. Members’ Training Steering Group
19. Members’ Equipment Steering Group
26. Safeguarding Reference Group…”

7. As a result of the Commissioner’s decision in FS50569254, the Council provided the complainant with a new response on 3 September 2015. It said that these four parts were exempt from disclosure under section 36(2)(b)(i) and (ii) and that the public interest favours withholding the information. It said part 26 of the request was also exempt under section 40 (personal data).

8. Given the history of this request, the Council did not undertake an internal review and the matter was referred to the Commissioner. However, as part of the Commissioner’s investigation, the Council did review its response and reconsidered its response with regard to part 26 of the request. It withdrew its reliance on section 36 and section 40 and disclosed this particular information to the complainant on 11 January 2016.

2



Reference: FS50596346

Scope of the case



9. The complainant had contacted the Commissioner on 7 September 2015 to complain about the way the four parts of his original request for information had been handled.

10. The Council has now disclosed part 26 of the requested information to the complainant. The Commissioner has therefore focussed his investigation on the Council’s application of the exemption at section 36 to parts 15, 18 and 19 of the request and its public interest arguments.

Reasons for decision



Section 36 – prejudice to effective conduct of public affairs

11. Section 36(2)(b)(i) and (ii) of the FOIA says that information that is held by a public authority is exempt if, in the reasonable opinion of a qualified person, disclosing it would, or would be likely to, inhibit the free and frank provision of advice, and the free and frank exchange of views for the purposes of deliberation.

12. Section 36 differs from all other prejudice exemptions in that the judgement about prejudice must be made by the legally authorised, qualified person for that public authority. The qualified person’s opinion must also be a “reasonable” opinion, and the Commissioner may decide that the section 36 exemption has not been properly applied if he finds that the opinion given is not reasonable.

13. Other than for information held by Parliament, section 36 is a qualified exemption. This means that even if the qualified person considers that disclosure would cause harm, or would be likely to cause harm, the public interest must still be considered.

14. In determining whether the Council correctly applied the exemption, the Commissioner is required to consider the qualified person’s opinion as well as the reasoning that informed the opinion. Therefore in order to establish that the exemption has been applied correctly the Commissioner must:


  • ascertain who was the qualified person or persons

  • establish that an opinion was given by the qualified person

  • ascertain when the opinion was given; and

  • consider whether the opinion was reasonable.

3



Reference: FSSOS96346

15. The information in question concerns the minutes of a Head Teachers and Teachers Joint Consultative Committee (JCC), action minutes of a Members’ Training Steering Group and actions from a Members’ Equipment Steering Group.

16. The Council has explained to the Commissioner that the qualified person in this case is the Council’s Head of Legal and Member Services who, under section 36(5)(o)(m), is authorised as the Monitoring Officer.

17. The Council showed the information in question to the qualified person on 27 October 2014, with an opinion on it sought under section 36(2)(b)(i) and 36(2)(b)(ii), as explained at paragraph 11. The Council says the qualified person met and discussed the information on several occasions with one of his solicitors and the Records and Information Manager. The opinion was given on 31 October 2014. The Council explained to the Commissioner that the request for information was originally submitted in March 2013 and confirmed that the qualified person’s opinion was sought in October 2014.

18. The qualified person upheld the view submitted to him that disclosing the information held in items 15, 18 and 19 would inhibit the free and frank provision of advice and the free and frank exchange of views for the purposes of deliberation.

19. With regard to item 15 — the Head Teachers and Teachers JCC – the qualified person considers that the information contained within these minutes concerns important matters which require consideration and deliberation. These matters include: comprehensive and fundamental reviews associated with the education sector; the current structure and service delivery models of education; budgetary options and proposals for improvement and potential change. The qualified person says that deliberating all these matters needs a “safe space” and, in his opinion, disclosing the requested information would be likely to have a “chilling effect”. This would inhibit the free and frank provision of advice and exchange of views between Members, officers and other representatives.

20. The qualified person additionally considers that any disclosure would be likely to undermine the ability of this group, and those advising this group, to express themselves in a frank and open manner. This would then lead to poorer decision making. The qualified person considers that it is crucial that this group is able to exchange views in an open and frank manner for the reasons set out above.

21. With regard to items 18 and 19 — the Members’ Training Steering Group action minutes and actions from Members’ Equipment Steering Group — the qualified person says that the information contained within these

4



Reference: FS50596346

sets of minutes relates to important matters affecting elected Members, which requires consideration and deliberation. Matters debated include: elected Members’ training; use of electronic equipment; developing the Council of the Future; spending; service delivery models and proposals for improvement and potential change.

22. The qualified person says that this level of debate also needs a “safe space” to effectively engage the participants. In his opinion disclosing this information would be likely to have a “chilling effect” that would inhibit the free and frank provision of advice or exchange of views between elected Members and officers. Furthermore, disclosure is likely to undermine the ability of these steering groups’, and those advising these groups, to express themselves in a free and frank manner. This would then lead to poorer decision making.

23. The Commissioner first notes that the Trust has sought the opinion of its Monitoring Officer. He is satisfied that the Monitoring Officer is a suitably qualified person. This is because the Monitoring Officer post within a local authority has the specific duty to ensure that the council, its officers and its elected members maintain the highest standard of conduct in all they do. It is one of three posts that local authorities have a legal duty to have, the other two being the Chief Executive and
the Director of Finance.

24. In order to determine whether the exemption is engaged the Commissioner must then go on to decide whether the qualified person’s opinion in this case is reasonable. This involves considering:

  • Whether the prejudice claimed relates to the specific subsection of section 36(2) on which the Council is relying

  • The nature of the information and the timing of the request; and

  • The qualified person’s knowledge or involvement in the issue.

25. The Commissioner has also issued guidance on section 36 of the FOIA. With regard to what can be considered a ‘reasonable opinion’ it says the following:

“The most relevant definition of ‘reasonable’ in the Shorter Oxford English Dictionary is ‘In accordance with reason; not irrational or absurd’. If the opinion is in accordance with reason and not irrational or absurd — in short, if it is an opinion that a reasonable person could hold — then it is reasonable.”

26. It is important to note that when considering whether the exemption is engaged, the Commissioner is making a decision not on whether he agrees with the opinion of the qualified person, but whether it was reasonable for him or her to reach that opinion. The test of

5



Reference: FS50596346

reasonableness is not meant to be a high hurdle and if the Commissioner accepts that the opinion is one that a reasonable person could hold he must find that the exemption is engaged.

27. The Council is relying on subsections (b)(i) and b(ii) of section 36(2), namely that disclosing the withheld information would, or would be likely to inhibit the free and frank provision of advice, and the free and frank exchange of views for the purposes of deliberation. The qualified person in this case has said that prejudice, namely a “chilling effect” on the provision of advice and exchange of views that would lead to poorer decision making, would be likely to occur if the information were to be disclosed (rather than would occur).

28. The Commissioner accepts that it is important that the Council’s meetings are conducted openly with participants able to contribute candidly and to discuss issues freely. The Council and the public can then be confident that decisions made at these meetings are likely to be robust. He therefore accepts that the prejudice the Council is claiming does relate to section 36(2)(b)(i) and (ii).

29. The Commissioner has referred to the information requested at parts 15, 18 and 19 of the wider request. The information concerns meetings that took place in February and March 2013, shortly before the complainant submitted his request. In his view, the meetings are unconnected to each other or to one wider matter.

30. The Commissioner notes that the qualified person has had several discussions with a solicitor and the Records and Information Manager about the matter. He considers that, although the qualified person did not participate in the meetings in question, the qualified person would understand the nature of the meetings and have a good knowledge of the circumstances surrounding the request.

31. Having undertaken the above review of the qualified person’s opinion, the Commissioner is satisfied that, in the circumstances, it is a reasonable opinion ie it is not irrational or absurd. Therefore, the exemption at section 36(2)(b)(i) and (ii) is engaged with regard to items 15, 18 and 19.

Public interest test

32. In most cases, even when the qualified person has given their opinion that section 36(2)(b) is engaged, the public authority must still carry out a public interest test. The qualified person’s opinion will affect the weight of the argument for withholding the information. If the qualified person has decided that disclosure would prejudice, this will carry a greater weight than if they said

6



Reference: FS50596346

disclosure would be likely to prejudice.

33. The qualified person’s opinion brings weight to the arguments for withholding the information; the significance of this weight will vary from case to case. When considering a complaint regarding section 36, if the Commissioner finds that the opinion was reasonable, he will consider the weight of that opinion in the public interest test. This means that he accepts that a reasonable opinion has been expressed that prejudice would, or would be likely to occur, but he will go on to consider the severity, extent and frequency of that prejudice in forming his own assessment of whether the public interest test dictates disclosure.

34. In his guidance on section 36, the Commissioner says that it should always be possible for the public authority to review the public interest arguments. The Commissioner gave the Council the opportunity to do this during the course of his investigation. The Council confirmed on 14 January 2016 that it continues to rely on its arguments from October 2014.

Public interest arguments in favour of disclosure

35. With regard to item 15, the qualified person says that disclosing these minutes would give the public insight into the processes involved within the Council for decision making on important issues of the day. Disclosing these minutes would also demonstrate transparency with regard to internal processes and with regard to the exchange of views and advice.

36. With regard to items 18 and 19, the qualified person says that disclosure of these action minutes would give an insight into how the Council analyses and reviews information with a view to shaping and
developing for the future. These action minutes would also allow the public to see proposals that the Council is considering.

37. The complainant did not submit any public interest arguments.

Public interest arguments in favour of maintaining the exemption

38. The qualified person considers that the public interest favours maintaining the exemption with respect to these three items of information because disclosing the information would restrict the free and frank exchange of views, would inhibit the giving of advice and guidance and would potentially have a detrimental effect on the work of these groups and those taking part in their discussions. He says that the Council relies on the ability to have a “safe space” to enable it to

7



Reference: FS50596346

make the most appropriate decisions for elected Members, officers and the people of Wirral.

Balance of the public interest

39. The Commissioner first of all notes that the qualified person has said that releasing the information would be likely to inhibit free and frank advice and exchange of views. This potentially brings less weight to the argument for withholding the information than would inhibit.

40. In his published guidance on section 36, the Commissioner notes at paragraph 45 that 36(2)(b)(i) and (ii) are about the processes that may be inhibited, rather than what is in the information. The issue is whether disclosure would inhibit the processes of providing advice or exchanging views. In order to engage the exemption, the information requested does not necessarily have to contain views and advice that are in themselves notably free and frank.

41. On the other hand, if the information only consists of relatively neutral statements, then it may not be reasonable to think that its disclosure could inhibit the provision of advice or the exchange of views.

42. Paragraph 46 of the Commissioner’s guidance discusses the terminology used in the exemption, as follows:

  • ‘Inhibit’ means to restrain, decrease or suppress the freedom with which opinions or options are expressed.
  • Examples of ‘advice’ include recommendations made by more junior staff to more senior staff, professional advice tendered by professionally qualified employees, advice received from external sources, or advice supplied to external sources. However, an exchange of data or purely factual information would not in itself constitute the provision of advice or, for that matter, the exchange of views.
  • The ‘exchange of views’ must be as part of a process of deliberation.

  • ‘Deliberation’ refers to the public authority’s evaluation of competing arguments or considerations in order to make a decision.

43. As in this case, arguments under section 36(2)(b)(i) and (ii) are usually based on the concept of a ‘chilling effect’. The chilling effect argument is that disclosure of discussions would inhibit free and frank discussions in the future, and that the loss of frankness and candour would damage

8



Reference: FS50596346

the quality of advice and deliberation and lead to poorer decision making.

44. Public officials are expected to be impartial and robust when giving advice, and not easily deterred from expressing their views by the possibility of future disclosure. It is also possible that the threat of future disclosure could actually lead to better quality advice. Nonetheless, chilling effect arguments cannot be dismissed out of hand.

45. Chilling effect arguments operate at various levels. If the issue in question is still live, arguments about a chilling effect on those ongoing discussions are likely to be most convincing. Arguments about the effect on closely related live issues may also be relevant. However, once the decision in question is finalised, chilling effect arguments become more and more speculative as time passes. It will be more difficult to make reasonable arguments about a generalised chilling effect on all future discussions.

46. Whether it is reasonable to think that a chilling effect would occur will depend on the circumstances of each case, including the timing of the request, whether the issue is still live, and the actual content and sensitivity of the information in question.

47. The Commissioner has reviewed the information in question. Items 15 and 19 are minutes/actions from meetings held February 2013, item 18 is the action minutes from a meeting that was held in March 2013. At the time of the complainant’s request therefore, the meetings in question were very recent and the subjects under discussion would still have been live at the time of the request.

48. Item 15 is the minutes of the Headteachers’ and Teachers’ Joint Consultative Committee meeting on 28 February 2013 and is described as such ie as ‘Minutes’. As such they summarise the discussion that occurred in the meeting. The content of the minutes is as described at paragraph 19. They include summaries of participants’ exchange of views and their evaluation of particular proposals in order to reach a decision. The Commissioner considers that this Committee would have needed a safe space in which to freely and frankly deliberate on important and potentially sensitive matters such as fundamental reviews associated with the education sector; the current structure and service delivery models of education; budgetary options and proposals for improvement and potential change.

49. Given the closeness between the meeting in February 2013 and the original request for its minutes in March 2013, the Commissioner is persuaded that releasing these minutes may have been likely to have a chilling effect on subsequent meetings of this Committee. He agrees

9



Reference: FS50596346

with the Council that the public interest favours this particular information being withheld in order to protect the Committee’s ability to make decisions based on full and frank discussions.

50. The Commissioner has next considered items 18 and 19. Item 18 — the Member Steering Group – is described as ‘Action Minutes’. For the most part, only the agreed actions that resulted from the discussions are noted, with a brief summary of one or two points. Item 19 — the Members’ Equipment Steering Group’ — is described as ‘Actions’ and only agreed actions that resulted from the discussions are noted.

51. The Commissioner recognises that the meetings took place shortly before the request was submitted and that the matters under discussion were still live at that time, to some degree. However, he does not consider that the matters under discussion — elected Members’ training and equipment needs — is of sufficient sensitivity that disclosing the information would have a chilling effect on subsequent meetings of these two groups, and inhibit the process of providing advice or exchanging views. In addition, the overwhelming majority of the information held in these two documents is agreed actions, very briefly summarised, and not summaries of broader discussion and deliberation on these two matters. The Council has said that releasing this information would be likely to inhibit free and frank advice and exchange of views but its evidence for this is somewhat generic and consequently not strong. As a result, the Commissioner considers that the public interest favours releasing items 18 and 19 in the interests of transparency.

10



Reference: FS50596346

Right of appeal



52. Either party has the right to appeal against this decision notice to the First-tier Tribunal (Information Rights). Information about the appeals process may be obtained from:

First-tier Tribunal (Information Rights)
GRC & GRP Tribunals
PO Box 9300
LEICESTER
LE1 8DJ

Tel: 0300 1234504
Fax: 0870 739 5836

Email: GRC@hmcts.gsi.gov.uk
Website: www.justice.gov.uk/tribunals/general-regulatory-chamber

53. If you wish to appeal against a decision notice, you can obtain information on how to appeal along with the relevant forms from the Information Tribunal website.

54. Any Notice of Appeal should be served on the Tribunal within 28 (calendar) days of the date on which this decision notice is sent.

Signed …….(signature of Pamela Clements)………..

Pamela Clements
Group Manager
Information Commissioner’s Office
Wycliffe House
Water Lane
Wilmslow
Cheshire
SK9 5AF

11

If you click on any of the buttons below, you’ll be doing me a favour by sharing this article with other people.

Chief Fire Officer recommends new fire station at Saughall Massie and closure of fire stations at West Kirby and Upton

Chief Fire Officer recommends new fire station at Saughall Massie and closure of fire stations at West Kirby and Upton

Chief Fire Officer recommends new fire station at Saughall Massie and closure of fire stations at West Kirby and Upton

                                                  

Dan Stephens (Chief Fire Officer, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service) answers questions at a public consultation meeting in Saughall Massie to discuss proposals for a new fire station (20th April 2015). Kieran Timmins (Deputy Chief Executive) is on the right.
Dan Stephens (Chief Fire Officer) answers questions at a public consultation meeting in Saughall Massie to discuss proposals for a new fire station (20th April 2015)

There are four agenda items on the agenda of next week’s Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority public meeting that relate to the decision about the future of West Kirby Fire Station and Upton Fire Station.

First (item 3) is a petition asking for Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority to “Stop the building of the Fire Station in Saughall Massie and the destruction of precious green belt land”. At the time of writing this petition on the change.org website has 321 signatures. The comments of the signatories can be read here.

According to section 11.3 of the constitution for Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority:

“The presentation of a petition shall be limited to not more than 5 minutes and shall be confined to reading out or summarising the subject of the petition indicating the number and description of the signatories, and making such further supporting remarks relevant to the petition as the person presenting it shall think fit.”

Item 4 is a “deputation in relation to the merger of Upton and West Kirby fire stations”. This is described on the agenda as “To consider a deputation of Wirral residents and Councillors concerning the proposed merger of Upton and West Kirby Fire Stations at the site identified in Saughall Massie.”

Section 11.4 to 11.7 of the constitution deal with the procedure for deputations:

“11.4 Any person likely to be affected by a matter in relation to which the Authority has functions, (other than employees in relation to matters of conditions of service) may ask that a deputation should be received by a meeting of the Authority. Such a request shall be made to the Proper Officer at least seven working days before the meeting to which it relates. The person making the request shall indicate the matter to which the request relates, the number (which shall not be more than five names and addresses of the persons who will form the deputation, and the member or members of the deputation who will speak for them).

11.5 On being called by the Person Presiding, the person or persons speaking for the deputation may make, during a period not exceeding five minutes, such remarks as she/he or they think fit, providing that the remarks shall relate to the matter indicated.

11.6 The Members of the Authority may, during a further period not exceeding five minutes for each deputation, ask questions of the members of the deputation. Such questions shall be asked and
answered without discussion.

11.7 Petitions shall be presented, and deputations received in the order in which notice of them is received by the Proper Officer, without making any distinction between petitions and deputations.”

Agenda item 7 is titled Wirral West Fire Cover Consultation 2 outcomes. The reports for this agenda item come to 236 pages!

Finally agenda item 8 (operational response savings options for Wirral) is the agenda item when an actual decision will be made.

This agenda item comprises of a report detailing the Chief Fire Officer’s recommendations to councillors (the following is quoted from the report and is the Chief Fire Officer’s recommendation (Wirral MBC stands for Wirral Metropolitan Borough Council and fire appliance means fire engine):

“a. approve the merger of Upton and West Kirby fire stations at a new station on Saughall Massie Road, subject to agreement from Wirral MBC to transfer ownership of the land to the Authority and the granting of planning permission;

b. approve the relocation of the West Kirby fire appliance to Upton to be crewed wholetime retained as an interim measure prior to the construction of the new station

c. amend the capital programme to incorporate the Saughall Massie fire station scheme; and

d. give delegated authority to the Chief Fire Officer (CFO) to continue discussions with partners, including Merseyside Police and North West Ambulance Service, with a view to sharing the new building.”

There are of course other options that are in theory available to councillors (but I’ll make it clear these are options which the Chief Fire Officer doesn’t recommend). These other options include the outright closure of West Kirby Fire Station and the relocation of the West Kirby fire engine to Upton Fire Station.

Due to the sheer volume of responses to this consultation, whatever I write below is going to leave something out. However I will do my best to summarise some of the responses to the consultation.

I had better also declare an interest at this point, as in the report on press articles/letters to the press on page 4 Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority have included the blog post I wrote on the 20th April 2015 headlined Public consultation meeting in Saughall Massie on proposed new fire station (along with three comments written by Alan Dransfield, keef666 and Jean).

The people of Saughall Massie are opposed to a fire station being built at the proposed site (currently owned by Wirral Council) on Saughall Massie Road. There are a variety of reasons given ranging from traffic, green belt issues, noise/disturbance and concerns that building on the Saughall Massie Road site is inadvisable due to regular flooding.

Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service paid Opinion Research Services £19,195.00 (a spin out company of Swansea University) to do a report for the consultation. Their 49 page report details the results of a range of polling techniques including focus groups, a forum and a postal residents survey.

The deliberative forum for Saughall Massie found opposition to a new fire station there. Most of the group they asked from Upton were also opposed to the use of a greenbelt site at Saughall Massie, but at the same time supported a new fire station in the Saughall Massie area. The West Kirby group & the all Wirral forum were in favour of the Saughall Massie site being used for a new fire station. However ORS does state “deliberative forums cannot be certified as statistically representative samples of public opinion”.

A postal questionnaire was also sent out by ORS to 10,000 households (5,000 to the West Kirby Fire Station area and 5,000 to the Upton Fire Station area). Out of the 1,351 postal questionnaires that were returned a majority in both Upton (51%) and West Kirby (70%) areas went for option one (merging Upton and West Kirby fire stations by building a new fire station in Saughall Massie).

However these findings come with caveats as ORS also state:

“However, consultation is not a numbers game, in which the majority view necessarily prevails (like in a referendum), so the Fire Authority will wish to consider carefully all the arguments, evidence and considerations relevant to this case before taking its decision based upon its assessment of the public good.”

Here are some quotes from the members of the public that responded to the consultation and a link to the full 40 page document:

“As a resident of West Kirby and a mother of three young children I object to the proposals to close West Kirby fire station.

This is a ridiculous and dangerous proposal and directly increases the risk of death, from a house fire, to my family.”

“Also please provide a credible reason as to why, in a democratic and fair society, the residents of Saughall Massie’s overwhelming feelings of resistance to this proposed fire station are being overridden by the local Labour Council when equal or lesser feelings of resistance by those in Greasby were considered in full and their request to reject the proposed building of this facility (on a brown field site) was granted.”

“I live next to Saughall Massie Road and during the morning and evening “rush hours” it’s very heavily congested to a far greater extent than other local roads at these times. ”

“I object to the proposed fire station in Saughall Massie because:-

  • lives could be lost as Saughall Massie Road is already congested. Between 8am and 9.30am Mon-Fri – severe congestion
  • no open space for dogs & horses to run free
  • our properties will de-value
  • damage to wildlife habitats”

“Re Fire Station Saughall Massie Road

I would like to register my disapproval at the above. Building on Greenbelt land is out of order.”

“I would hope that you agree that Monday night’s fiasco did not satisfy the criteria as a meaningful consultation exercise. Having said that, you must be aware that the overwhelming views of the residents, both inside and on the pavement outside, was that this development does not take place at all within our precious ‘Green Belt’.”

Proposal for a fire station, Saughall Massie, Wirral

I am writing to express my concerns over the proposal to build a fire station on the greenbelt land at Saughall Massie. I live directly opposite the suggested site and am disappointed to learn of this proposal which I personally use at least twice a day to both exercise my dog and meet up with other local residents. There is also a great deal of wildlife and the beautiful Jenny’s Wood. There are water voles, bats, owls to name a few and I am sure that many of these beautiful creatures will be affected by this build if it goes ahead.

I wish to register that I am totally opposed to the build and wish my feelings to be noted.”

The Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority will make a decision on the future of the fire stations at Upton and West Kirby at a public meeting starting at 1.00pm on Tuesday 30th June 2015 in the Liverpool Suite, ground floor, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service Headquarters, Bridle Road, Bootle, L30 4YD. The agenda and reports for that meeting can be found on their website.

If you click on any of the buttons below, you’ll be doing me a favour by sharing this article with other people.