Can you find the £883,000 in savings needed to keep Upton & West Kirby fire stations open?
Can you find the £883,000 in savings needed to keep Upton & West Kirby fire stations open?
Dan Stephens (Chief Fire Officer) answers questions at a public consultation meeting in Saughall Massie to discuss proposals for a new fire station (20th April 2015)
As the consultation closes in the next few days on the issue of closing West Kirby and Upton fire stations and building a new fire station at Saughall Massie (the consultation closes on the 18th May 2015) I thought it would be useful to publish the list of payments over £500 made by the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service over the past year.
Bear in mind that to keep both stations open, £883,000 in savings (or about £74,000 for each month) would have to be found from the revenue budget. Savings can’t come from the payments under the long-term PFI contract with Balfour Beatty Fire and Rescue NW Ltd for building new fire stations. I’m sure there are other long-term contracts that the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service have that some of the payments over £500 may be for.
Saughall Massie residents ask Wirral Council for reasons why greenbelt site suggested for new fire station
Saughall Massie residents ask Wirral Council for reasons why greenbelt site suggested for new fire station
Dan Stephens (Chief Fire Officer) answers questions at a public consultation meeting in Saughall Massie to discuss proposals for a new fire station (20th April 2015)
Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service consultation meeting Saughall Massie 20th April 2015 Part 3 of 4
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Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service consultation meeting Saughall Massie 20th April 2015 Part 4 of 4
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A member of the audience asked why Upton fire station couldn’t just be enlarged? Dan Stephens replied that if they did that, then it would increase response times to the West Kirby station area. He repeated what he had said earlier about how they couldn’t afford two fire stations and it was best to have one as close to the middle of the two existing fire stations as they could get.
Someone asked whether a completed risk assessment had been carried out on the impact on traffic of a new fire station in Saughall Massie? The answer was that such issues would be picked up in a future planning application. The Chief Fire Officer pointed out again that the roads in Wirral were no more challenging than roads elsewhere in Merseyside.
The next woman brought up environmental issues, heritage issues, property prices and said “my life will be definitely be blighted by this fire station” and she wanted to know “how it’s going to affect me here”. The Chief Fire Officer explained that his role was to be held to account for community safety matters. He said that the issues she had raised were ones for a planning committee to consider.
She asked a further question about why the proposal in Greasby had been thrown out and whether that was planning? The Chief Officer answered “No” and explained that they hadn’t got to the planning stage at Greasby. He added that they didn’t own the land at Greasby and the offer of the land had been withdrawn. Such questions would have to be asked of Wirral Council.
David Armstrong (Wirral Council) answered that the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority had approached Wirral Council to find a site. Three sites were identified in a built up area, one of which was the one in Greasby. That site didn’t go ahead “for a number of reasons” so they broadened the search out.
Mr Armstrong was next asked what the reasons were that they hadn’t proceeded with the Greasby site. Councillor Chris Blakeley gave his opinion that he thought the Council wanted to “make politics out of it”. Kieran Timmins chairing the meeting reminded Councillor Blakeley that it was not a political meeting.
“What reasons?” was asked again of David Armstrong. He answered, “As the idea developed, as the feedback came from the consultation meetings, as we looked at it more closely and we tried to explore it with the community centre who didn’t sign up to it at all. We looked into issues of grant which we’d had government grant to extend the library and the children’s centre et cetera, et cetera it became obvious that that scheme was not going to work. It was still important to have the consultation which you’re having now. The Council has done no more than cooperate with the fire service to have discussion about the fire safety of 26,000 people.
We started out looking at the sites that weren’t greenbelt and weren’t green space. There were three in Greasby. One was a triangular piece of land next to the cricket club that the Council owned which didn’t work because the fire service for understandable reasons like to have a site where they can take the fire tender in, drive it in, they need a substantial sized site.
We looked at a piece of land that the Council owns next to the second roundabout, not the Sainsburys one, the one nearest Greasby which has a dead-end spur into a piece of land. It’s leased to the Woodland Trust for 100 years. It’s very close to Upton, it didn’t give the fire service the location it needed.
That left us then with the Greasby site. When it became apparent that that wasn’t going to work, we broadened the search out we looked at the greenbelt sites and we presented them to the Fire Authority and that’s all we’ve done to have this discussion and debate because as Dan [Stephens] said earlier the decision will have to be made at the end of the day as to whether that can work in terms of fire safety, whether it would work for the people that live there and all those things would have to be brought together.
The Council has yet to reach a decision on whether to release the land, it will await the outcome of this consultation, that will feed into things and a report that will go to Council. If the Fire Authority wish to pursue this option because they’ve got that decision to make, if they do that, if the Fire Authority come back to the Council and say this is the only option, we’d like to pursue this, the Council will have to make a decision whether or not to release the site.
If the Council did decide to release the site, the Fire Authority then would have to apply for planning permission and an entirely separate process within the Council and that again would address all the issues, the environmental issues, the location issues, the planning issues as well.”
Saughall Massie residents express their opposition to fire station plans at first consultation meeting
Saughall Massie residents express their opposition to fire station plans at first consultation meeting
Dan Stephens (Chief Fire Officer) answers questions at a public consultation meeting in Saughall Massie to discuss proposals for a new fire station (20th April 2015)
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Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service consultation meeting Saughall Massie 20th April 2015 Part 1 of 4
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Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service consultation meeting Saughall Massie 20th April 2015 Part 2 of 4
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Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service consultation meeting Saughall Massie 20th April 2015 Part 3 of 4
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Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service consultation meeting Saughall Massie 20th April 2015 Part 4 of 4
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Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service consultation meeting Saughall Massie 20th April 2015 Playlist of all parts 1-4
A consultation meeting in Saughall Massie to hear from the public on a proposed new fire station in Saughall Massie Road started badly when over a hundred people who came to the meeting were turned away from the St Marys Centre because the meeting was full. Despite repeated requests at the start of the meeting by a local councillor for a further meeting in Saughall Massie, Dan Stephens (Chief Fire Officer) refused to commit himself to a further public meeting however did say it was something he would “carefully consider”.
The Chief Fire Officer explained that if Upton and West Kirby fire stations were closed, then in his view (although people didn’t have to agree with him) a new fire station would be needed near the midpoint of the two existing fire stations. If a new fire station wasn’t built in Saughall Massie and only West Kirby fire station was closed, then it would lead to an increase in response times to the former West Kirby station area. He made it clear that after the consultation was finished the final decision on what happens next would be taken by the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority, who would have to consider public safety and response times. The views expressed at the public consultation meetings would be reported back to the Fire Authority.
The first person who asked a question felt that gridlock in the roads around Saughall Massie at certain times and narrow roads would lead to an increase in response times if a new fire station was built in Saughall Massie. The Chief Fire Officer responded that he felt the traffic conditions “were no worse than they are anywhere else on Merseyside”.
Continuing with his question the same person pointed out that twice a day the road from Saughall Massie to West Kirby was blocked by cattle being moved between fields. He suggested that they look for brownfield sites instead.
The Chief Fire Officer explained that they didn’t have compulsory purchase powers and that as they’d already been through a consultation on Greasby that the matters needed to be resolved. He said that if West Kirby fire station was closed and Upton kept open, then the fire engines (from Upton) would need to travel down the same roads to the West Kirby area.
Another member of the public pointed out that the number of incidents responded to by the fire service was falling year on year. She asked if Upton fire station could be used for less callouts?
Dan Stephens replied that it wasn’t the number of incidents that was important but the type of the incident. There were 26,000 people living in the West Kirby station area, therefore “it’s an absolute certainty we will have another domestic property fire”. In his view it didn’t matter that the total number of incidents were going down, but as long as people lived there, there would be incidents. He said, “It’s about run times, not numbers of incidents.”
The next person to ask a question pointed out that the map showing response times of Saughall Massie versus Upton showed that from Upton, an over 10 minute response time would be mainly to fields and a golf course. Replying to his point, the Chief Fire Officer said that there was still a good proportion that was an 8 to 9 minute response time compared to only 6 to 7 minutes from Saughall Massie.
A resident of Saughall Massie said that she wasn’t in agreement with a new fire station in Saughall Massie and that “if you feel that that’s the best place you have to prove it to everybody”. Dan Stephens replied that they couldn’t afford two fire stations, but could only have one. That one fire station would have to be in the middle.
The next question was from the secretary of the Saughall Massie Conservation Area Society. He said he was not going to talk about conservation or greenbelt, but response. His question was if BRVs (brigade response vehicles) would be considered? The Chief Fire Officer explained that the brigade response vehicles weren’t of much use in responding to a domestic property fire or a road traffic collision. He pointed out that West Midlands Fire and Rescue Authority could afford BRVs, but Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority couldn’t. BRVs were for antisocial small fires, but would have to be manned by three extra people that they couldn’t afford.
A further question asked was why couldn’t the council tax that pays for the fire service on Merseyside be increased by £5? The answer given was that to do that would require a referendum which would cost an estimated £2 million.
The Chief Fire Officer was then asked if he would consider other options such as BRVs? He said he would not consider them as they “give me absolutely nothing in terms of operational response” and that he would be “paying for an asset that gave me absolutely nothing”.
The next woman referred to a petition about the closure of West Kirby fire station and speculation about plans for a multi-storey shopping centre there. Dan Stephens said that there had been no consideration of the disposal of the site at West Kirby because no decision had yet been made to close it. The same woman referred to the “Greater Concourse plan”. David Armstrong (Assistant Chief Executive, Wirral Council) said that “there are no current plans for anything at the West Kirby site”.
Public consultation meeting in Saughall Massie on proposed new fire station
Public consultation meeting in Saughall Massie on proposed new fire station
Dan Stephens Chief Fire Officer, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service at Greasby Methodist Church Hall, Greasby Road, Greasby last year for a consultation meeting on the proposed closure of Upton and West Kirby fire stations
Tonight, the first of three public meetings will be held (starting at 6.30pm at the St Mary’s Centre, 127 Saughall Massie Road, CH49 4LA) to consult with the public on options which include building a new fire station in Saughall Massie (if Upton Fire Station & West Kirby Fire Station close). Another option being consulted on is the closure of West Kirby Fire Station and keeping Upton Fire Station open.
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service have produced an eighteen page consultation document which details their reasons for the consultation. There is also an online questionnaire as part of the consultation and you can email consultation2@merseyfire.gov.uk with your views or write to Wirral Consultation, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service, Bridle Road, Bootle, L30 4YD.
The twelve week consultation ends on the 18th May 2015 and there will be two further public meetings in addition to the one tonight in Saughall Massie.
Tuesday, 28th April, at Holy Cross Church community rooms, by Holy Cross Church, Woodchurch, CH49 7LS, starting at 6.30pm.
Tuesday, 5th May, at Hoylake Community Centre, The Parade, Hoyle Road, Hoylake, CH47 3AG, starting at 6.30pm.
Cllr Lesley Rennie refers to proposed Saughall Massie fire station site in green belt as “a piece of scrappy land”
Cllr Lesley Rennie refers to proposed Saughall Massie fire station site in green belt as “a piece of scrappy land”
Cllr Lesley Rennie speaking at a public meeting of Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority 29th January 2015 on a consultation on closure of Upton and West Kirby fire stations and a new fire station at Saughall Massie
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Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority meeting 29th January 2014 Part 2 of 2 starting at what councillors said on agenda item 5 (West Wirral Operational Response Considerations (Post Consultation))
