Why weren’t Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service “open and transparent” about the estimated £0.5 million they could receive from the sale of Upton and West Kirby fire stations?
Why weren’t Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service “open and transparent” about the estimated £0.5 million they could receive from the sale of Upton and West Kirby fire stations?
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority 30th June 2015 L to R Kieran Timmins (Deputy Chief Executive), Phil Garrigan (Deputy Chief Fire Officer), Dan Stephens (Chief Fire Officer), Cllr Byrom (Vice-Chair), Janet Henshaw (Monitoring Officer)
So surprised was Cllr Byrom (above) by heckling that he forgot to propose a resolution keeping details out of the public domain about how much they’d receive for Upton and West Kirby fire stations if they sold them.
On the 14th June 2015 I made a Freedom of Information Act request to the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service for two unpublished reports to the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority on “the costs of any new build station, together with an estimate of the potential income from the sale of the buildings and land at Upton and West Kirby.” You can read my original request on the whatdotheyknow website.
On the 15th June 2015 I received an acknowledgement of my request stating that the request would be responded to either under the Freedom of Information legislation or the Environmental Information Regulations 2004 within 20 working days.
On the 8th July 2015 Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service refused the request referring to two regulations in the Environmental Information Regulations 2004 as justification:
Regulation 12 (5) (d) Confidentiality of public authority proceedings when covered by law.
Regulation 12 (5) (e) Confidentiality of commercial or industrial information, when protected by law to cover legitimate economic interest.
Below is my (admittedly rather cross) response seeking the Environmental Information Regulations 2004 equivalent of an internal review which is referred to in the legislation as a representation and reconsideration.
Dear Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service,
Please pass this on to the person who conducts Freedom of Information reviews.
I am writing to request an internal review of Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service’s handling of my FOI request ‘Reports on Upton & West Kirby fire stations’.
Thank you for your response (dated 8th July 2015) to my request dated 14th June 2015.
Firstly I wish to contest the sentences which state “As the information you have requested does not contain environmental information we have processed your request under Freedom of Information legislation. In accordance with the Freedom of Information Act 2004 this letter acts as a Public Interest Refusal Notice. “
As stated in my request the information requested contains “the costs of any new build station, together with an estimate of the potential income from the sale of the buildings and land at Upton
and West Kirby”.
“the same meaning as in Article 2(1) of the Directive, namely any information in written, visual, aural, electronic or any other material form on—
(a) the state of the elements of the environment, such as air and atmosphere, water, soil, land, landscape and natural sites including wetlands, coastal and marine areas, biological diversity and its components, including genetically modified organisms, and the interaction among these elements;
(b) factors, such as substances, energy, noise, radiation or waste, including radioactive waste, emissions, discharges and other releases into the environment, affecting or likely to affect the elements of the environment referred to in (a);
(c) measures (including administrative measures), such as policies, legislation, plans, programmes, environmental agreements, and activities affecting or likely to affect the elements and factors referred to in (a) and (b) as well as measures or activities designed to protect those elements;
(d) reports on the implementation of environmental legislation;
(e) cost-benefit and other economic analyses and assumptions used within the framework of the measures and activities referred to in (c); and
(f) the state of human health and safety, including the contamination of the food chain, where relevant, conditions of human life, cultural sites and built structures inasmuch as they are or may be affected by the state of the elements of the environment referred to in (a) or, through those elements, by any of the matters referred to in (b) and (c);”
As you can see from the above, the information requested would fall under (c) and (e) above.
There is no such thing as the Freedom of Information Act 2004.
If you are referring to the Freedom of Information Act 2000, then your refusal notice does not contain the information required by law. Section 17 of the Freedom of Information Act 2000 c.36 requires a refusal notice to specify the exemption (or exemptions) in question and why they apply.
However, considering that you wrote “Freedom of Information Act 2004” when you meant to write “Environmental Information Regulations 2004” and when you wrote “does not contain environmental information” must have meant “does contain environmental information” (otherwise why quote reasons for refusal referring to regulations that are part of the Environmental Information Regulations 2004, please class this as a representation (see regulation 11 of the Environmental Information Regulations 2004) for reconsideration.
“(5) For the purposes of paragraph (1)(a), a public authority may refuse to disclose information to the extent that its disclosure would adversely affect—
….
(d)the confidentiality of the proceedings of that or any other public authority where such confidentiality is provided by law;”
I am aware that at the public meetings of the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority held on the 2nd October 2014 and 29th January 2015 that a resolution at each meeting (based on the recommendation of
officer/s) was agreed by councillors.
Although a recommendation was made by officers that councillors at that meeting pass a resolution excluding this information from the public domain, no such resolution was agreed at that meeting.
Such matters are dealt with as the first item on the agenda which the agenda of the meeting of the 30th June 2015 specified thus:
“1. Preliminary Matters
The Authority is requested to consider the identification of:
a) declarations of interest by individual Members in relation to any item of business on the Agenda
b) any additional items of business which the Chair has determined should be considered as matters of urgency; and
c) items of business which may require the exclusion of the press and public during consideration thereof because of the possibility of the disclosure of exempt information.”
You can watch a video recording of this part of the meeting here (see below)
Please accept YouTube cookies to play this video. By accepting you will be accessing content from YouTube, a service provided by an external third party.
If you accept this notice, your choice will be saved and the page will refresh.
, but for the purposes of this reconsideration I include a transcript of that items 1 & 2 of that meeting below:
“Cllr Leslie T Byrom (Vice-Chair of the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority): You may start recording from this moment if you like. Moving to preliminary matters, we have two minutes of the previous meetings.
Member of public: Excuse me, could you introduce yourselves so we know who you are?
Cllr Leslie T Byrom (Vice-Chair of the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority): We don’t normally do that. We don’t normally do that, everybody has their…
Member of public: Well I can’t see who you are from here!
Cllr Leslie T Byrom (Vice-Chair of the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority): I’m going to press on with the meeting and if I may say you know I’m assuming that everybody is going to be respectful and follow the normal procedures for meetings. I don’t think like Barack Obama we’re going to have to sing to bring order back again.
We will proceed with the meeting, I’m chairing the meeting and we’ll carry on if you don’t mind. So we move on to minutes of the previous meeting, those are on pages seven to twenty. Are they agreed?
Councillors: Agreed.
Cllr Leslie T Byrom (Vice-Chair of the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority): There is an issue about declarations of interest, do Members have any declarations of interest?
Is there any suggestions about the changes in the agenda and the items of business? Councillor Rennie?
Cllr Lesley Rennie (Lead Member for Operational Preparedness): Chair, could I ask because there are so many members of the public and obviously ward councillors for the items on the agenda 7 and 8 in relation to Saughall Massie, would you errm be willing to perhaps rearrange the order of business in order to facilitate them for an early getaway or is there a reason perhaps why that may not be possible?
Cllr Leslie T Byrom (Vice-Chair of the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority): We have had some discussions about this. There are a number of items and they won’t be long I don’t think that relate to the financial background to the Authority which I think would be helpful to the members of the public to understand the context against which we’re making some discussions.
There are also proposals for changes and amalgamations in err St Helens, and I think again I don’t think it’ll be a long item, but I think for the public who are here to look at decisions further down the agenda it would be useful and interesting to see, you know that it’s not just in isolation, there are other items on the agenda as well.
So if you don’t mind, I think we could, we will…
Member of the public: You can’t do that.
Cllr Leslie T Byrom (Vice-Chair of the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority): Would you give order please? Errm, we will proceed with the agenda as it’s printed if that’s alright, but if it gets lengthy, if it get’s lengthy we’ll look at that because I’ll know the public have got some distance to travel, but we’ll sit with the agenda as printed if you don’t mind. So we’ll move on to item 3 on the agenda, that’s pages 21-30 and that is the petition concerning the merger of Upton and West Kirby fire stations.”
As you can see from the above no resolution was agreed by councillors at that meeting keeping the report on capital costs out of the public domain. That decision (made on the 30th June 2015) was made before your decision on my request (made on the 8th July 2015).
Section 100C of the Local Government Act 1972 states (please note in the definitions in 100J(1)(f)“principal council” also refers to fire and rescue authorities such as the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority, therefore this report is open to public inspection as no resolution was passed:
“(1) After a meeting of a principal council the following documents shall be open to inspection by members of the public at the offices of the council until the expiration of the period of six years beginning with the date of the meeting, namely—
(a) the minutes, or a copy of the minutes, of the meeting, excluding so much of the minutes of proceedings during which the meeting was not open to the public as discloses exempt information;
(b) where applicable, a summary under subsection (2) below;
(c) a copy of the agenda for the meeting; and
(d) a copy of so much of any report for the meeting as relates to any item during which the meeting was open to the public.
(2) Where, in consequence of the exclusion of parts of the minutes which disclose exempt information, the document open to inspection under subsection (1)(a) above does not provide members of the public with a reasonably fair and coherent record of the whole or part of the proceedings, the proper officer shall make a written summary of the proceedings or the part, as the case may be, which provides such a record without disclosing the exempt information.”
Decisions and background papers to be made available to the public
“8.—(1) The written record, together with any background papers, must as soon as reasonably practicable after the record is made, be made available for inspection by members of the public—
(a) at all reasonable hours, at the offices of the relevant local government body;
(b) on the website of the relevant local government body, if it has one; and,
(c) by such other means that the relevant local government body considers appropriate.
(2) On request and on receipt of payment of postage, copying or other necessary charge for transmission, the relevant local government body must provide to the person who has made the request and paid the appropriate charges—
(a) a copy of the written record;
(b) a copy of any background papers.
(3) The written record must be retained by the relevant local government body and made available for inspection by the public for a period of six years beginning with the date on which the decision, to which the record relates, was made.
(4) Any background papers must be retained by the relevant local government body and made available for inspection by the public for a period of four years beginning with the date on which the decision, to which the background papers relate, was made.
(5) In this regulation “written record” means the record required to be made by regulation 7(1) or the record referred to in regulation 7(4), as the case may be.”
Offences
10.—(1) A person who has custody of a document which is required by regulation 8 to be available for inspection by members of the public commits an offence if, without reasonable excuse, that person—
(a) intentionally obstructs any person exercising a right conferred under this Part in relation to inspecting written records and background papers; or
(b) refuses any request under this Part to provide written records or background papers.
(2) A person who commits an offence under paragraph (1) is liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding level 1 on the standard scale.”
As no resolution was passed at the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority’s meeting of the 30th June 2015 to exclude this information from the public domain, the above regulations required it to be published “as soon as practicable” on your website (which hasn’t happened).
As this request was refused after the decision made by councillors on the 30th June 2015 that this information should be in the public domain, the fact it’s not been published on your website since is arguably a breach of regulation 8(1)(b) of the Openness of Local Government Bodies Regulations 2014 and refusal of this request could be interpreted as a criminal offence (see regulation 10).
Dealing with your refusal under Regulation 12(5)(e)“Confidentiality of commercial or industrial information, when protected by law to cover legitimate economic interest”, obviously if you agree with me on the above points refusal on this ground is a moot point.
Earlier this year I made a request to Wirral Council for the address of land they had purchased. Like yourselves, the request was refused with reference to regulation 12(5)(e) at internal review.
In your response you state “The reason why the public interest favours withholding the information is because the information contained within these documents is deemed to be commercially sensitive and the disclosure of such information is not deemed to be in the public interest as it may jeopardise the Authority’s position with regards to any future negotiations concerning the sites in question. As a Public Authority Merseyside Fire & Rescue Authority have a duty to negotiate the best possible financial deal to protect the public purse which in course enable’s the authority to provide the best possible service.”
At the moment, Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority have not got planning permission for a new fire station on the Saughall Massie site. This is a process that could take as long as six months (or longer if permission is refused then appealed to the Planning Inspectorate). During that time it is highly likely that land & property prices in the areas of Saughall Massie, Upton and West Kirby will change, it is also possible that planning permission for the Saughall Massie site will be refused. Therefore if Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority make a decision in the future to sell those sites, a further up to date valuation would have to be done to prove considerations of best value to its auditors and taxpayers on Merseyside.
There is a presumption in favour of disclosure in the Environmental Information Regulations 2004. I consider that the arguments I have made here in representations in favour of disclosure in relation to your refusal on grounds in Regulation 12(5)(d), including pointing out why following the meeting of the 30th June 2015 this information (seemingly in breach of regulation 8 of the Openness of Local Government Bodies Regulations 2014) hasn’t been published on your website and the issue of whether refusal of this request constitutes a criminal offence (regulations 8/10 of the Local
Government Bodies Regulations 2014) means that this information should be disclosed as a matter of urgency.
As pointed out in the decision notice I refer to (FS50576394), you have a legal duty to provide such information within a 20 working day timescale of the original request (made on the 14th June 2015).
I hope having considered this representation carefully you will reconsider your decision and provide the requested information.
Finally (although I didn’t mention this in the request above) Dan Stephens the Chief Fire Officer/Chief Executive of Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service stated in an email recently to me:
“I would hope you recognise that we have been open and transparent throughout the Greasby and Saughall Massie consultation processes and that it is very important to us that this is maintained throughout.”
So does anyone think that the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service & Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority are being “open and transparent” about the matter referred to above?
If you click on any of the buttons below, you’ll be doing me a favour by sharing this article with other people.
Wirral Council planning on green belt fire station “there would be some planning policy issues”
Wirral Council planning on green belt fire station “there would be some planning policy issues”
Dan Stephens (Chief Fire Officer) answers questions at a public consultation meeting in Saughall Massie to discuss proposals for a new fire station (20th April 2015)
Continuing from Wednesday’s blog post headlined Wirral Council planning on green belt fire station “inappropriate development” & “potential for significant harm”, I thought people might be interested in more of the emails that went between Wirral Council and the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service about the plans for a fire station in Wirral West as it seems that detailed discussions were going on behind the scenes both at officer level at Wirral Council & Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service, as well as discussions with councillors too.
Timmins, Kieran
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 29 April 2014 13:02 To: ‘Ball, David, S.’ Cc: Armstrong, David; Simpson, Tony Subject: RE: Greasby sites
Very helpful. Thank you all
No need to explore further at present
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
From: Ball, David S Sent: 29 April 2014 12:58 To: Timmins, Kieran Cc: Armstrong, David; Simpson, Tony Subject FW: Greasby sites
Kieran,
Here is the view on this site from my Forward Planning team. It seems that there would be some planning policy issues here but I can explore it further if you want me to.
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Entwhistle, John C. Sent: 29 April 2014 12:56 To: Ball, David S. Subject: RE: Greasby sites
David – the land on the opposite site of Frankby road to St John the Divine is in the Green Belt so a fire station would be inappropriate development and very special circumstances would have to be demonstrated. However there is potential for significant harm to the Green Belt in this location because of its role in maintaining separation between Greasby and Frankby.
John Entwistle Principal Forward Planning Officer,
Forward Planning,
Regeneration and Environment,
Wirral Council,
Town Hall, Brighton Street
Wallasey, Merseyside
CH44 8ED
Telephone: 0151 691 8221
email: johnentwistle@wirral.gov.uk
Fax: 0151 691 8273
Visit our website www.wirral.gov.uk
Please save paper and print out only what is necessary.
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 29 April 2014 12:19 To: Entwhistle, John C. Subject: FW: Greasby sites Importance: High
John,
Do we know anything about this site?
Would a fire station be an acceptable use?
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Timmins, Kieran [mailto:KieranTimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 29 April 2014 08:54 To: Ball, David S. Subject: Greasby sites
Hi David
Do you know anything about land sited on Frankby road opposite St John the divine church? Is that a possible fire station site?
Cheers
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
Timmins, Kieran
From: Halpin, Colleen S. on behalf of Armstrong, David Sent: 07 May 2014 16:49 To: Timmins, Kieran Subject: RE: Greasby Sites
Dear Kieran
Did Tony provide you with the contact for the Woodland Trust?
Any outstanding issues re us moving into Birkenhead Fire Station?
Regards
David Armstrong
Head of Universal Services CYPD
And Assistant Chief Executive
Colleen Halpin
PA to Director of Children’s Services
Children and Young People’s Department
Wirral Council
Tel: 0151 666 4288
Fax: 0151 666 4338
E-mail: colleenhalpin@wirral.gov.uk
www.wirral.gov.uk
From: Timmins, Kieran [mailto:KieranTimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 29 April 2014 06:36 To: Armstrong, David Subject: Greasby Sites
HI David
Can you send me your contact details for the woodland trust (did you have any joy with them?).
Many thanks
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
Timmins, Kieran
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 07 May 2014 17:53 To: Armstrong, David Cc: Schofield, Colin Subject: RE: Greasby Sites
Hi David
Tony hasn’t had a chance to send details yet. Be grateful if you could follow up.
Colin, Can you update us on current position on Birkenhead.
Thanks
Kieran
Timmins, Kieran
From: Halpin, Colleen S. on behalf of Armstrong, David Sent: 07 May 2014 16:49 To: Timmins, Kieran Subject: RE: Greasby Sites
Dear Kieran
Did Tony provide you with the contact for the Woodland Trust?
Any outstanding issues re us moving into Birkenhead Fire Station?
Regards
David Armstrong
Head of Universal Services CYPD
And Assistant Chief Executive
Colleen Halpin
PA to Director of Children’s Services
Children and Young People’s Department
Wirral Council
Tel: 0151 666 4288
Fax: 0151 666 4338
E-mail: colleenhalpin@wirral.gov.uk
www.wirral.gov.uk
From: Timmins, Kieran [mailto:KieranTimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 29 April 2014 06:36 To: Armstrong, David Subject: Greasby Sites
HI David
Can you send me your contact details for the woodland trust (did you have any joy with them?).
Many thanks
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
From: Simpson, Tony Sent: 16 May 2014 11:37 To: Armstrong, David; Schofield, Colin, Timmins, Kieran Cc: Royle, Jeannette E. Subject: RE: Greasby Sites
DavidSmith@woodlandtrust.org.uk]
Regards
Tony
From:/B> Lloyd, Tina A. On Behalf Of Armstrong, David Sent: 15 May 2014 15:37 To: ‘Schofield, Colin’; Timmins, Kieran; Armstrong, David Cc: Simpson, Tony; Royle, Jeannette E. Subject: RE: Greasby Sites
Re Birkenhead – I have now signed off a draft report for Cabinet Member approval ASAP. That should allow the other documents to be completed.
Thanks
Tina Lloyd on behalf of
David Armstrong
Head of Universal Services CYPD
and Assistant Chief Executive
Wirral Council
Tel: 0151 666 4313
Fax: 0151 666 4338
email: tinalloyd@wirral.gov.uk
Visit our website: www.wirral.gov.uk
From: Schofield, Colin [mailto:ColinSchofield@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 07 May 2014 18:02 To: Timmins, Kieran; Armstrong, David Subject: Re: Greasby Sites
Kieran
Re Birkenhead, draft lease & associated documents are with Dawn to pass to Wirral’s legal team for consideration.
Need to sort out ICT connections but move in date shouldn’t be too far away.
Regards
Col
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 05:53 PM To: Armstrong, David Cc: Schofield, Colin Subject: RE: Greasby Sites
Hi David
Tony hasn’t had a chance to send details yet. Be grateful if you could follow up.
Colin, Can you update us on current position on Birkenhead.
Thanks
Kieran
From: Halpin, Colleen S. [ColleenHalpin@wirral.gov.uk] on behalf of Armstrong, David [davidarmstrong@wirral.gov.uk] Sent: 07 May 2014 16:48 To: Timmins, Kieran Subject: RE: Greasby Sites
Dear Kieran
Did Tony provide you with the contact for the Woodland Trust?
Any outstanding issues re us moving into Birkenhead Fire Station?
Regards
David Armstrong
Head of Universal Services CYPD
And Assistant Chief Executive
Colleen Halpin
PA to Director of Children’s Services
Children and Young People’s Department
Wirral Council
Tel: 0151 666 4288
Fax: 0151 666 4338
E-mail: colleenhalpin@wirral.gov.uk
www.wirral.gov.uk
From: Timmins, Kieran [mailto:KieranTimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 29 April 2014 06:36 To: Armstrong, David Subject: Greasby Sites
HI David
Can you send me your contact details for the woodland trust (did you have any joy with them?).
Many thanks
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
Timmins, Kieran
From: Simpson, Tony Sent: 16 May 2014 11:37 To: Armstrong, David; Schofield, Colin, Timmins, Kieran Cc: Royle, Jeannette E. Subject: RE: Greasby Sites
DavidSmith@woodlandtrust.org.uk]
Regards
Tony
From:/B> Lloyd, Tina A. On Behalf Of Armstrong, David Sent: 15 May 2014 15:37 To: ‘Schofield, Colin’; Timmins, Kieran; Armstrong, David Cc: Simpson, Tony; Royle, Jeannette E. Subject: RE: Greasby Sites
Re Birkenhead – I have now signed off a draft report for Cabinet Member approval ASAP. That should allow the other documents to be completed.
Thanks
Tina Lloyd on behalf of
David Armstrong
Head of Universal Services CYPD
and Assistant Chief Executive
Wirral Council
Tel: 0151 666 4313
Fax: 0151 666 4338
email: tinalloyd@wirral.gov.uk
Visit our website: www.wirral.gov.uk
From: Schofield, Colin [mailto:ColinSchofield@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 07 May 2014 18:02 To: Timmins, Kieran; Armstrong, David Subject: Re: Greasby Sites
Kieran
Re Birkenhead, draft lease & associated documents are with Dawn to pass to Wirral’s legal team for consideration.
Need to sort out ICT connections but move in date shouldn’t be too far away.
Regards
Col
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 05:53 PM To: Armstrong, David Cc: Schofield, Colin Subject: RE: Greasby Sites
Hi David
Tony hasn’t had a chance to send details yet. Be grateful if you could follow up.
Colin, Can you update us on current position on Birkenhead.
Thanks
Kieran
From: Halpin, Colleen S. [ColleenHalpin@wirral.gov.uk] on behalf of Armstrong, David [davidarmstrong@wirral.gov.uk] Sent: 07 May 2014 16:48 To: Timmins, Kieran Subject: RE: Greasby Sites
Dear Kieran
Did Tony provide you with the contact for the Woodland Trust?
Any outstanding issues re us moving into Birkenhead Fire Station?
Regards
David Armstrong
Head of Universal Services CYPD
And Assistant Chief Executive
Colleen Halpin
PA to Director of Children’s Services
Children and Young People’s Department
Wirral Council
Tel: 0151 666 4288
Fax: 0151 666 4338
E-mail: colleenhalpin@wirral.gov.uk
www.wirral.gov.uk
From: Timmins, Kieran [mailto:KieranTimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 29 April 2014 06:36 To: Armstrong, David Subject: Greasby Sites
HI David
Can you send me your contact details for the woodland trust (did you have any joy with them?).
Many thanks
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
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Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 16 May 2014 13:27 To: Schofield, Colin Cc: Timmins, Kieran Subject: RE: GREASBY
Colin,
This work is in progress and we should have something by next Tuesday.
David
DAVID BALL Head of Regeneration and Planning Regeneration and Environment Department Wirral Council
From: Schofield, Colin [mailto:ColinSchofield@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 16 May 2014 08:48 To: Ball, David S. Cc: Timmins, Kieran Subject: GREASBY
Hi David
Following on from when we spoke last week, I recall you were going to get someone to look at the land at Upton By-pass/Saughall Massie Road to see if there was any potential for us to consider it as a site for the new merged Upton/West Kirby fire station. I think you also suggested that you’d get someone to produce a plan showing any ‘spare land’ in the Greasby area (back to the By-pass) so we can continue to seek out a potential site for the new station.
I was just wondering if you had any news on either of these please?
Regards
Colin
Colin Schofield Regional Project Director North West Fire & Rescue Services PFI Project c/o Merseyside F&RS HQ Bridle Road Bootle Merseyside L30 4YD tel 0151 296 4203 mob 07780 997933 fax 0151 296 4224 email colinschofield@merseyfire.gov.uk
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
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Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 19 May 2014 10:41 To: Schofield, Colin Cc: Timmins, Kieran Subject: FW: Potential Fire Station Sites Attachments: Land Corner Saughall Massie Road 1_2500.pdf; Land North Upton Cricket Club 1_2500.pdf
Colin,
Confidential
Further to our recent conversation and the e-mail exchange last week, please find attached and below some thoughts from my Planning Policy Team about potential sites. Unfortunately, as you will read, there are a number of constraints to these sites but we are having difficulty identifying suitable sites in the Greasby area.
Happy to discuss!
David DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Austin, Hannah Sent: 19 May 2014 10:17 To: Ball, David S. CC: Fraser, Andrew S. Subject: Potential Fire Station Sites
David,
Further to your discussion with Andrew on Friday, please find attached site plans of two potential sites for the relocation of Upton Fire Station. We examined the whole area and these are the only sites that we consider have potential, in addition to the site already being considered. It should be noted, however, that these are still subject to significant constraints. The land at the corner of Saughall Massie Road is a Council-owned densely wooded site with access constraints. It is likely that there would be significant highways issues at the junction with Upton By-Pass. The land to the north of Upton Cricket Club is also subject to access constraints and is currently used for horse grazing. It has been submitted through the Call for Sites exercise for consideration for housing. Both sites are also less than 1 mile away from the existing station in Upton.
In terms of Green Belt sites, this type of development would be considered inappropriate and very special circumstances would need to be demonstrated to justify development. The capacity to accommodate fire engines on Frankby Road and the western part of Saughall Massie Road may also act as a constraint to development in Greasby/Saughall Massie.
I hope this helps. If you need anything else please let me know.
Kind regards
Hannah Austin Senior Planning Officer
Wirral Council
Regeneration and Planning Service, North Annexe, Wallasey Town Hall, Brighton Street, Wallasey, Wirral CH44 8ED
Tel: 0151 691 8192
Email: hannahaustin@wirral.gov.uk
Fax: 0151 691 8188
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David, S. Sent: 19 May 2014 13:02 To: Schofield, Colin Cc: Timmins, Kieran Subject: FW: Potential Fire Station Sites (further info) Attachments: Land Corner Saughall Massie Road 1_2500.pdf; Land North Upton Cricket Club 1_2500.pdf
Colin,
CONFIDENTIAL
Update on sites!
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Fraser, Andrew S. Sent: 19 May 2014 11:36 To: Ball, David S. Subject: FW: Potential Fire Station Sites [further info]
David.
Just to say that the site at the corner of Saughall Massie Road is a designated Urban Greenspace but although highly visible it does not really function as an accessible public open space and Overchurch Park is within 400m to the north, albeit on the other side of the bypass. The visual landscaping impact alongside the bypass could however be retained without retaining the whole of the rest of the site (although this is still likely to be controversial!). The highways issues are however likely to be overriding.
Thanks
Andrew Fraser, Forward Planning Manager
Regeneration and Planning Service
Tel: 0151 691 8218 Fax: 0151 691 8188
From: Austin, Hannah Sent: 19 May 2014 10:17 To: Ball, David S. CC: Fraser, Andrew S. Subject: Potential Fire Station Sites
David,
Further to your discussion with Andrew on Friday, please find attached site plans of two potential sites for the relocation of Upton Fire Station. We examined the whole area and these are the only sites that we consider have potential, in addition to the site already being considered. It should be noted, however, that these are still subject to significant constraints. The land at the corner of Saughall Massie Road is a Council-owned densely wooded site with access constraints. It is likely that there would be significant highways issues at the junction with Upton By-Pass. The land to the north of Upton Cricket Club is also subject to access constraints and is currently used for horse grazing. It has been submitted through the Call for Sites exercise for consideration for housing. Both sites are also less than 1 mile away from the existing station in Upton.
In terms of Green Belt sites, this type of development would be considered inappropriate and very special circumstances would need to be demonstrated to justify development. The capacity to accommodate fire engines on Frankby Road and the western part of Saughall Massie Road may also act as a constraint to development in Greasby/Saughall Massie.
I hope this helps. If you need anything else please let me know.
Kind regards
Hannah Austin Senior Planning Officer
Wirral Council
Regeneration and Planning Service, North Annexe, Wallasey Town Hall, Brighton Street, Wallasey, Wirral CH44 8ED
Tel: 0151 691 8192
Email: hannahaustin@wirral.gov.uk
Fax: 0151 691 8188
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
Timmins, Kieran
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 19 May 2014 15:46 To: ‘Ball, David S.’ Cc: Schofield, Colin Subject: RE: Potential Fire Station Sites (further info)
Thanks again David
Would be grateful if colleagues able to give any more details on concerns on the highway’s issues. We tend to find that
a) Fire stations are a lot quieter than people imagine and rarely respond under blue lights
b) Quite often appliances respond when they are off site doing home fire safety checks etc
Thanks
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
From: Ball, David, S. Sent: 19 May 2014 13:02 To: Schofield, Colin Cc: Timmins, Kieran Subject: FW: Potential Fire Station Sites (further info) Attachments: Land Corner Saughall Massie Road 1_2500.pdf; Land North Upton Cricket Club 1_2500.pdf
Colin,
CONFIDENTIAL
Update on sites!
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Fraser, Andrew S. Sent: 19 May 2014 11:36 To: Ball, David S. Subject: FW: Potential Fire Station Sites [further info]
David.
Just to say that the site at the corner of Saughall Massie Road is a designated Urban Greenspace but although highly visible it does not really function as an accessible public open space and Overchurch Park is within 400m to the north, albeit on the other side of the bypass. The visual landscaping impact alongside the bypass could however be retained without retaining the whole of the rest of the site (although this is still likely to be controversial!). The highways issues are however likely to be overriding.
Thanks
Andrew Fraser, Forward Planning Manager
Regeneration and Planning Service
Tel: 0151 691 8218 Fax: 0151 691 8188
From: Austin, Hannah Sent: 19 May 2014 10:17 To: Ball, David S. CC: Fraser, Andrew S. Subject: Potential Fire Station Sites
David,
Further to your discussion with Andrew on Friday, please find attached site plans of two potential sites for the relocation of Upton Fire Station. We examined the whole area and these are the only sites that we consider have potential, in addition to the site already being considered. It should be noted, however, that these are still subject to significant constraints. The land at the corner of Saughall Massie Road is a Council-owned densely wooded site with access constraints. It is likely that there would be significant highways issues at the junction with Upton By-Pass. The land to the north of Upton Cricket Club is also subject to access constraints and is currently used for horse grazing. It has been submitted through the Call for Sites exercise for consideration for housing. Both sites are also less than 1 mile away from the existing station in Upton.
In terms of Green Belt sites, this type of development would be considered inappropriate and very special circumstances would need to be demonstrated to justify development. The capacity to accommodate fire engines on Frankby Road and the western part of Saughall Massie Road may also act as a constraint to development in Greasby/Saughall Massie.
I hope this helps. If you need anything else please let me know.
Kind regards
Hannah Austin Senior Planning Officer
Wirral Council
Regeneration and Planning Service, North Annexe, Wallasey Town Hall, Brighton Street, Wallasey, Wirral CH44 8ED
Tel: 0151 691 8192
Email: hannahaustin@wirral.gov.uk
Fax: 0151 691 8188
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 20 May 2014 08:01 To: Timmins, Kieran Cc: Schofield, Colin Subject: RE: Potential Fire Station Sites [further info]
Kieran,
I will look into the highway issues in more detail.
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 19 May 2014 15:46 To: ‘Ball, David S.’ Cc: Schofield, Colin Subject: RE: Potential Fire Station Sites (further info)
Thanks again David
Would be grateful if colleagues able to give any more details on concerns on the highway’s issues. We tend to find that
a) Fire stations are a lot quieter than people imagine and rarely respond under blue lights
b) Quite often appliances respond when they are off site doing home fire safety checks etc
Thanks
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
From: Ball, David, S. Sent: 19 May 2014 13:02 To: Schofield, Colin Cc: Timmins, Kieran Subject: FW: Potential Fire Station Sites (further info) Attachments: Land Corner Saughall Massie Road 1_2500.pdf; Land North Upton Cricket Club 1_2500.pdf
Colin,
CONFIDENTIAL
Update on sites!
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Fraser, Andrew S. Sent: 19 May 2014 11:36 To: Ball, David S. Subject: FW: Potential Fire Station Sites [further info]
David.
Just to say that the site at the corner of Saughall Massie Road is a designated Urban Greenspace but although highly visible it does not really function as an accessible public open space and Overchurch Park is within 400m to the north, albeit on the other side of the bypass. The visual landscaping impact alongside the bypass could however be retained without retaining the whole of the rest of the site (although this is still likely to be controversial!). The highways issues are however likely to be overriding.
Thanks
Andrew Fraser, Forward Planning Manager
Regeneration and Planning Service
Tel: 0151 691 8218 Fax: 0151 691 8188
From: Austin, Hannah Sent: 19 May 2014 10:17 To: Ball, David S. CC: Fraser, Andrew S. Subject: Potential Fire Station Sites
David,
Further to your discussion with Andrew on Friday, please find attached site plans of two potential sites for the relocation of Upton Fire Station. We examined the whole area and these are the only sites that we consider have potential, in addition to the site already being considered. It should be noted, however, that these are still subject to significant constraints. The land at the corner of Saughall Massie Road is a Council-owned densely wooded site with access constraints. It is likely that there would be significant highways issues at the junction with Upton By-Pass. The land to the north of Upton Cricket Club is also subject to access constraints and is currently used for horse grazing. It has been submitted through the Call for Sites exercise for consideration for housing. Both sites are also less than 1 mile away from the existing station in Upton.
In terms of Green Belt sites, this type of development would be considered inappropriate and very special circumstances would need to be demonstrated to justify development. The capacity to accommodate fire engines on Frankby Road and the western part of Saughall Massie Road may also act as a constraint to development in Greasby/Saughall Massie.
I hope this helps. If you need anything else please let me know.
Kind regards
Hannah Austin Senior Planning Officer
Wirral Council
Regeneration and Planning Service, North Annexe, Wallasey Town Hall, Brighton Street, Wallasey, Wirral CH44 8ED
Tel: 0151 691 8192
Email: hannahaustin@wirral.gov.uk
Fax: 0151 691 8188
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 25 June 2014 08:11 To: Schofield, Colin Cc: Timmins, Kieran Subject: RE: Potential Fire Station Sites [further info]
Colin,
Apologies for the delay in replying as things have been very busy of late.
On an initial look and taking into account your comments in your e-mail of 19 may, I think we could look at this positively subject to detailed design.
I hope this helps.
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Schofield, Colin [mailto:ColinSchofield@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 25 June 2014 07:55 To: Ball, David S. Cc: Timmins, Kieran Subject: RE: Potential Fire Station Sites [further info] Importance: High
Hi David
Do you have any further update on this please?
I understand that Dan Stephens is meeting Councillor Phil Davies on Tuesday & I need to update him before that meeting.
Regards
Colin
From: Schofield, Colin Sent: 04 June 2014 07:58 To: ‘Ball, David S.’ Cc: Timmins, Kieran Subject: RE: Potential Fire Station Sites [further info]
David
Is there any further news on the highways issues please?
Regards
Colin
Colin Schofield Regional Project Director North West Fire & Rescue Services PFI Project c/o Merseyside F&RS HQ Bridle Road Bootle Merseyside L30 4YD tel 0151 296 4203 mob 07780 997933 fax 0151 296 4224 email colinschofield@merseyfire.gov.uk
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 20 May 2014 08:01 To: Timmins, Kieran Cc: Schofield, Colin Subject: RE: Potential Fire Station Sites [further info]
Kieran,
I will look into the highway issues in more detail.
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 19 May 2014 15:46 To: ‘Ball, David S.’ Cc: Schofield, Colin Subject: RE: Potential Fire Station Sites (further info)
Thanks again David
Would be grateful if colleagues able to give any more details on concerns on the highway’s issues. We tend to find that
a) Fire stations are a lot quieter than people imagine and rarely respond under blue lights
b) Quite often appliances respond when they are off site doing home fire safety checks etc
Thanks
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
From: Ball, David, S. Sent: 19 May 2014 13:02 To: Schofield, Colin Cc: Timmins, Kieran Subject: FW: Potential Fire Station Sites (further info) Attachments: Land Corner Saughall Massie Road 1_2500.pdf; Land North Upton Cricket Club 1_2500.pdf
Colin,
CONFIDENTIAL
Update on sites!
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Fraser, Andrew S. Sent: 19 May 2014 11:36 To: Ball, David S. Subject: FW: Potential Fire Station Sites [further info]
David.
Just to say that the site at the corner of Saughall Massie Road is a designated Urban Greenspace but although highly visible it does not really function as an accessible public open space and Overchurch Park is within 400m to the north, albeit on the other side of the bypass. The visual landscaping impact alongside the bypass could however be retained without retaining the whole of the rest of the site (although this is still likely to be controversial!). The highways issues are however likely to be overriding.
Thanks
Andrew Fraser, Forward Planning Manager
Regeneration and Planning Service
Tel: 0151 691 8218 Fax: 0151 691 8188
From: Austin, Hannah Sent: 19 May 2014 10:17 To: Ball, David S. CC: Fraser, Andrew S. Subject: Potential Fire Station Sites
David,
Further to your discussion with Andrew on Friday, please find attached site plans of two potential sites for the relocation of Upton Fire Station. We examined the whole area and these are the only sites that we consider have potential, in addition to the site already being considered. It should be noted, however, that these are still subject to significant constraints. The land at the corner of Saughall Massie Road is a Council-owned densely wooded site with access constraints. It is likely that there would be significant highways issues at the junction with Upton By-Pass. The land to the north of Upton Cricket Club is also subject to access constraints and is currently used for horse grazing. It has been submitted through the Call for Sites exercise for consideration for housing. Both sites are also less than 1 mile away from the existing station in Upton.
In terms of Green Belt sites, this type of development would be considered inappropriate and very special circumstances would need to be demonstrated to justify development. The capacity to accommodate fire engines on Frankby Road and the western part of Saughall Massie Road may also act as a constraint to development in Greasby/Saughall Massie.
I hope this helps. If you need anything else please let me know.
Kind regards
Hannah Austin Senior Planning Officer
Wirral Council
Regeneration and Planning Service, North Annexe, Wallasey Town Hall, Brighton Street, Wallasey, Wirral CH44 8ED
Tel: 0151 691 8192
Email: hannahaustin@wirral.gov.uk
Fax: 0151 691 8188
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 09 July 2014 08:06 To: Timmins, Kieran Cc: Armstrong, David; Simpson, Tony; Blott, Joe R. Subject: Potential fire station sites in Wirral
Kieran,
Joe Blott, one of our Strategic Directors has asked me to contact you following the recent meeting that Dan Stevens had with the leader of the Council. I understand that one of the discussion points was the various sites that we have been discussing over the past few months for a potential new fire station.
I understand that there may be a need to consolidate all the correspondence and to come to a view if any of these sites are possible locations and if there is a preferred site fro the Council to let you know whether it is available (if we own it) and what the planning considerations may be. I know that we (Asset Management and me from a planning perspective) have discussed a number of sites but would it be useful to meet to come to a considered position on this matter?
Please can you let me know what would be best?
Thanks,
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
Timmins, Kieran
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 09 July 2014 17:02 To: ‘Ball, David S.’ Cc: Armstrong, David; Simpson, Tony; Blott, Joe R; ColinSchofield@merseyfire.gov.uk;NyreeCollinson@merseyfire.gov.uk Subject: RE: Potential fire station sites in Wirral
Hi David
That’s very timely as I was just discussing with Colin holding a meeting to review the site options and it would make a lot of sense to do that jointly with your input. I’ll get a meeting set up with Colin Schofield, myself and (is it just) you from the Wirral side?
Under separate cover I’ll send a copy of a short note I did for Dan trying to summarise where we are up to which might be useful for all
Best wishes
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 09 July 2014 08:06 To: Timmins, Kieran Cc: Armstrong, David; Simpson, Tony; Blott, Joe R. Subject: Potential fire station sites in Wirral
Kieran,
Joe Blott, one of our Strategic Directors has asked me to contact you following the recent meeting that Dan Stevens had with the leader of the Council. I understand that one of the discussion points was the various sites that we have been discussing over the past few months for a potential new fire station.
I understand that there may be a need to consolidate all the correspondence and to come to a view if any of these sites are possible locations and if there is a preferred site fro the Council to let you know whether it is available (if we own it) and what the planning considerations may be. I know that we (Asset Management and me from a planning perspective) have discussed a number of sites but would it be useful to meet to come to a considered position on this matter?
Please can you let me know what would be best?
Thanks,
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
Timmins, Kieran
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 09 July 2014 17:07 To: ‘Ball, David S.’ Cc: Armstrong, David; Simpson, Tony; Blott, Joe R; ColinSchofield@merseyfire.gov.uk;NyreeCollinson@merseyfire.gov.uk Subject: RE: Potential fire station sites in Wirral Attachments: summary of greasby sites update june 25.xlsx
Hi David,
Further to previous email see notes below and attachment which were provided for Chief Exec’s meeting
a) Sites discounted early
Two sites were considered at an early stage and discounted. One was a junior school on Mill Lane – there were concerns about access and no indications that school was willing to give up land. The second was a farm site on Arrowe road – No indications if land was for sale
b) Sites considered in more detail
Since then 6 sites have been considered in more detail. They have been identified by a mix of estates team detective work, suggestions by colleagues and suggestions by Wirral officers. The sites are analysed in more detail in the attached appendix. As it stands there are two “runners” left:-
Saughall Massie Road/Upton By Pass. This is owned by Wirral and looks quite positive based on recent correspondence despite being urban greenspace. It may be a little father from Greasby than planned but access good
The Library/Community hall site in middle of Greasby. However this site not suitable for ambulance services and we would have to deal with multiple partners. Locality is a political hot potato with large public outcry about supermarket development.
c) Latest Developments
Estates team have been liaising with various professional advisers to see if they had any information. We have heard rumours of one potential larger development being put together near Greasby. We are awaiting more details and location
Have also formally instructed Hardie Brack to look for sites and their report is awaited. We believe they may have identified three or four potential plots which we understand all to be farmland that might be for sale.
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 09 July 2014 08:06 To: Timmins, Kieran Cc: Armstrong, David; Simpson, Tony; Blott, Joe R. Subject: Potential fire station sites in Wirral
Kieran,
Joe Blott, one of our Strategic Directors has asked me to contact you following the recent meeting that Dan Stevens had with the leader of the Council. I understand that one of the discussion points was the various sites that we have been discussing over the past few months for a potential new fire station.
I understand that there may be a need to consolidate all the correspondence and to come to a view if any of these sites are possible locations and if there is a preferred site fro the Council to let you know whether it is available (if we own it) and what the planning considerations may be. I know that we (Asset Management and me from a planning perspective) have discussed a number of sites but would it be useful to meet to come to a considered position on this matter?
Please can you let me know what would be best?
Thanks,
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
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Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 09 July 2014 17:31 To: Timmins, Kieran Cc: Armstrong, David; Simpson, Tony, Blott, Joe R; Schofield, Colin; Collinson, Nyree Subject: RE: Potential fire station sites in Wirral
Kieran
I suggest me on the planning side and David and/or Tony on the assets side.
David
Sent from my HTC
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Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 25 July 2014 14:10 To: Timmins, Kieran; Schofield, Colin Subject: Fire Station -CONFIDENTIAL
Kieran and Colin,
It was good to see you this morning.
I have had the opportunity to speak with colleagues at officer level regarding the thoughts for the centre of Greasby and they are all supportive of the principle. I am now pulling together relevant space details and there are a number of options here which will be helpful. I will forward these as soon as I have them.
I will speak to David Armstrong on Monday about the land issues and will begin to sound out Cabinet Members around the middle of next week,
I will keep you advised.
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
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Timmins, Kieran
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 25 July 2014 22:01 To: Ball, David S.; Schofield, Colin Cc: Garrigan, Phil; Stephens, Dan Subject: RE: Fire Station – CONFIDENTIAL
Hi David
Thank you very much for your efforts and pragmatic advice. This seems a really exciting development and one the whole management team are really keen on.
We look forward to working with you to deliver …… Operation Reading by Firelight begins!
Thanks
Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 25 July 2014 14:09 To: Timmins, Kieran; Schofield, Colin Subject: Fire Station -CONFIDENTIAL
Kieran and Colin,
It was good to see you this morning.
I have had the opportunity to speak with colleagues at officer level regarding the thoughts for the centre of Greasby and they are all supportive of the principle. I am now pulling together relevant space details and there are a number of options here which will be helpful. I will forward these as soon as I have them.
I will speak to David Armstrong on Monday about the land issues and will begin to sound out Cabinet Members around the middle of next week,
I will keep you advised.
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
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Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 25 July 2014 22:06 To: Timmins, Kieran Subject: Re: Fire Station -CONFIDENTIAL
Kieran
You are welcome.
Let’s hope we succeed.
David
Sent from my HTC
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Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 04 August 2014 14:28 To: Timmins, Kieran Subject: RE: Update on station proposals for Upton and West Kirby
Kieran,
Thanks!
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Timmins, Kieran [mailto:KieranTimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 04 August 2014 14:23 To: Ball, David S. Subject: FW: Update on station proposals for Upton and West Kirby.
Hi David…… see Dan’s correspondence with Ester Mcvey below…..
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
From: Stephens, Dan Sent: 04 August 2014 14:17 To: Strategic Management Group Subject: FW: Update on station proposals for Upton and West Kirby.
Colleagues,
For your information.
Regards,
Dan Stephens,
Chief Fire Officer,
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service,
Bridle Road,
Bootle,
Merseyside,
L30 4YD
0151 296 4102
07967371690
dan.stephens@mfrs.cjsm.net
From: Stephens, Dan Sent: 04 August 2014 14:16 To: ‘RIMMER, Andrew’ Cc: Wainwright, Sandra Subject: RE: Update on station proposals for Upton and West Kirby.
Andrew,
We are, in conjunction with Wirral, exploring the possibility of a joint development on the site of the existing Library and Community Centre situated in between the Red Cat and Medical Centre on Frankby Road.
This would be an ideal location from an operational response perspective. The joint development may consist of a fire station, library and community facilities in an integrated building. It is possible North West Ambulance Service may also be interested in the development but that is by no means certain and would be subject to confirmation.
This proposal is at a relatively early stage and not all potential partners have yet been approached. Whilst I have a degree of confidence that such a development is deliverable I would ask that any response to constituents over this issue is heavily caveated to that effect.
My suggestion would be to respond along the lines of ‘Considerations are now focused on a site in the centre of Greasby in Wirral ownership. Whilst discussions are at a very early stage, the debate has been around delivering a shared public services facility that would add significant value to the community’.
Thanks,
Dan Stephens,
Chief Fire Officer,
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service,
Bridle Road,
Bootle,
Merseyside,
L30 4YD
0151 296 4102
07967371690
dan.stephens@mfrs.cjsm.net
From: RIMMER, Andrew [mailto:andrew.rimmer@parliament.uk] Sent: 04 August 2014 10:52 To: Stephens, Dan Cc: Wainwright, Sandrea Subject: RE: Update on station proposals for Upton and West Kirby. Importance: High
Sent on behalf of Esther McVey MP
Dear Dan
Further to your telephone call with Esther and email correspondence below regarding Fire Station proposals in Wirral West, would it be possible to update us on consideration of a site in Greasby so we have the latest information. It was one of the issues raised on Friday at the Over 60s Fair MFRS attended at Hoylake Community Centre.
Many thanks for your help.
Kind regards
Andrew
Andrew Rimmer
Office of Esther McVey MP
From:“Stephens,Dan” Date:8 May 2014 19:35:53 BST To:“MCVEY, Esther (2nd Mailbox)” Subject: RE: Update on station proposals for Upton and West Kirby.
Dear Esther,
For ease of reply I have inserted responses to your questions in the body of the e-mail below.
If it assists I can meet with you or give you a call when it is convenient for you to update you on progress?
Thanks,
Dan Stephens,
Chief Fire Officer,
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service,
Bridle Road,
Bootle,
Merseyside,
L30 4YD
0151 296 4102
07967371690
dan.stephens@mfrs.cjsm.net
From: MCVEY, Esther (2nd Mailbox) [mailto:officeofesthermcveymp@parliament.uk] Sent: 08 May 2014 14:14 To: Stephens, Dan Subject: FW: Update on station proposals for Upton and West Kirby
Dear Dan
Please could I ask for a quick update on decisions over stations in Wirral West following contact from constituents. Specifically
Have MFS identified land as yet in Greasby? – Not as yet. We are exploring the possibility of acquiring a site on the Greasby Frankby border and also a site at the junction of the Upton Bypass and Saughall Massie Road. As you are probably aware there are very few available plots of land in the area which would be appropriate for a fire (and possibly ambulance) station
If so when will any consultation process commence? – If we are able to acquire a site we will report this to the next scheduled Authority meeting and request approval to undertake a 12 week public consultation process immediately thereafter. I can send you the process we are utilising for the proposed merger in Knowsley (Huyton with Whiston) which was approved at the Authority meeting on 6th May if that would assist?
If not, what would the likely timescale be to implement alternative proposals and when would any consultation start? – If it becomes obvious that we will not be able to acquire a suitable site for a merger then we will report back to the Authority and advise them of the alternative options to a merger which on the Wirral would be the outright closure of West Kirby. Subject to Authority approval we would then undertake a 12 week consultation process immediately thereafter. Clearly this is the very last outcome we would want so we will explore every land option possible even if that requires consideration of alternative sites (hence the Upton Bypass and Saughall Massie Road reference above)
Many thanks in advance for an update on this matter.
With my best wishes
Esther McVey MP officeofesthermcveymp@parliament.uk
The Parade, Hoylake Community Centre
Hoyle Road, Hoylake
Wirral
CH47 3AG
UK Parliament Disclaimer:
This e-mail is confidential to the intended recipient. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender and delete it from your system. Any unauthorised use, disclosure, or copying is not permitted. This e-mail has been checked for viruses, but no liability is accepted for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this e-mail.
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
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UK Parliament Disclaimer:
This e-mail is confidential to the intended recipient. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender and delete it from your system. Any unauthorised use, disclosure, or copying is not permitted. This e-mail has been checked for viruses, but no liability is accepted for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this e-mail.
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
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This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
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Timmins, Kieran From: Ball, David S. Sent: 09 September 2014 09:25 To: Stephens, Dan; Timmins, Kieran Cc: Armstrong, David Subject: RE: Greasby Councillors
Dan and Kieran,
I saw Lesley Rennie last Friday and she did mention to me the meeting was taking place.
I was in meetings yesterday afternoon so only picked up the e-mail last night. Thanks for the update. I shall wait and see if Lesley can change their minds about this location or not. In the meantime I will not look at this any further until I have some view from the Councillors. I hope there is a positive outcome.
I have copied David Armstrong into this e-mail so he is aware of the latest situation.
Regards,
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Stephens, Dan [mailto:DanStephens@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 08 September 2014 18:57 To: Timmins, Kieran; Ball, David S. Subject: RE: Greasby Councillors
Thanks Kieran,
David – to confirm Tom and Wendy were very clear that they would oppose the proposal. I will however speak to Lesley Rennie to establish how likely they would be to change their position given the alternative.
Regards,
Dan Stephens,
Chief Fire Officer,
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service,
Bridle Road,
Bootle,
Merseyside,
L30 4YD
0151 296 4102
07967371690
dan.stephens@mfrs.cjsm.net
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 08 September 2014 18:07 To: davidball@wiral.gov.uk Cc: Stephens, Dan Subject: Greasby Councillors
HI David
Not sure if you got the message earlier – Tried to catch you on the phone before you went to council meeting.
Dan met Greasby councillors today – Wendy Clements and Tom Anderson (I think). This as at request of Lesley rennie. They do not appear to like the idea of a fire station in Greasby and their initial thought is to oppose the plan based on the conversation today. Dan explained that the alternative option was the closure of West Kirby outright which was also not platable and may cause them to reconsider. However it appeared that their initial view is to oppose.
Can you give me a buzz on 07855 207571 if you want to discuss
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
Timmins, Kieran
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 09 September 2014 09:28 To: ‘Ball, David S.’; Stephens, Dan Cc: Armstrong, David; Schofield, Colin Subject: RE: Greasby Councillors
HI David
I think we would like to initiate discussions with the community hall in any case. The issue we have is that as firefighters retire we can’t staff all the appliances and with two years to deliver a new station its important we don’t lose any time.
Unless that causes any major problems would you be agreeable to proceed. If nothing else at least we can work up properly what is proposed as a joint service hub that may help win hearts and minds!
What do you think?
Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 09 September 2014 09:25 To: Stephens, Dan; Timmins, Kieran Cc: Armstrong, David Subject: RE: Greasby Councillors
Dan and Kieran,
I saw Lesley Rennie last Friday and she did mention to me the meeting was taking place.
I was in meetings yesterday afternoon so only picked up the e-mail last night. Thanks for the update. I shall wait and see if Lesley can change their minds about this location or not. In the meantime I will not look at this any further until I have some view from the Councillors. I hope there is a positive outcome.
I have copied David Armstrong into this e-mail so he is aware of the latest situation.
Regards,
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From:; Stephens, Dan [mailto:DanStephens@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 08 September 2014 18:57 To: Timmins, Kieran; Ball, David S. Subject: RE: Greasby Councillors
Thanks Kieran,
David – to confirm Tom and Wendy were very clear that they would oppose the proposal. I will however speak to Lesley Rennie to establish how likely they would be to change their position given the alternative.
Regards,
Dan Stephens,
Chief Fire Officer,
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service,
Bridle Road,
Bootle,
Merseyside,
L30 4YD
0151 296 4102
07967371690
dan.stephens@mfrs.cjsm.net
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 08 September 2014 18:07 To: davidball@wiral.gov.uk Cc: Stephens, Dan Subject: Greasby Councillors
HI David
Not sure if you got the message earlier – Tried to catch you on the phone before you went to council meeting.
Dan met Greasby councillors today – Wendy Clements and Tom Anderson (I think). This as at request of Lesley rennie. They do not appear to like the idea of a fire station in Greasby and their initial thought is to oppose the plan based on the conversation today. Dan explained that the alternative option was the closure of West Kirby outright which was also not platable and may cause them to reconsider. However it appeared that their initial view is to oppose.
Can you give me a buzz on 07855 207571 if you want to discuss
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 09 September 2014 10:30 To: Stephens, Dan; Timmins, Kieran Cc: Armstrong, David; Schofield, Colin Subject: RE: Greasby Councillors
Dan,
I have just e-mailed Graham Burgess and David Armstrong on this matter and await their comments.
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Stephens, Dan [mailto:DanStephens@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 09 September 2014 09:50 To: Timmins, Keran; Ball, David S. Cc: Armstrong, David; Schofield, Colin Subject: RE: Greasby Councillors
David,
Can I suggest we have a meeting to discuss our options and possibly include Graham, Phil Davies and even Jeff Green please?
The alternative to a merger of West Kirby and Upton fire stations in an outright closure of West Kirby which we would move to public consultation on imminently. That will undoubtedly result in a degree of political impact and I would want us all to be on the same page in terms of a collective position.
Thanks,
Dan Stephens,
Chief Fire Officer,
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service,
Bridle Road,
Bootle,
Merseyside,
L30 4YD
0151 296 4102
07967371690
dan.stephens@mfrs.cjsm.net
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 09 September 2014 09:28 To: ‘Ball, David S.’; Stephens, Dan Cc: Armstrong, David; Schofield, Colin Subject: RE: Greasby Councillors
HI David
I think we would like to initiate discussions with the community hall in any case. The issue we have is that as firefighters retire we can’t staff all the appliances and with two years to deliver a new station its important we don’t lose any time.
Unless that causes any major problems would you be agreeable to proceed. If nothing else at least we can work up properly what is proposed as a joint service hub that may help win hearts and minds!
What do you think?
Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 09 September 2014 09:25 To: Stephens, Dan; Timmins, Kieran Cc: Armstrong, David Subject: RE: Greasby Councillors
Dan and Kieran,
I saw Lesley Rennie last Friday and she did mention to me the meeting was taking place.
I was in meetings yesterday afternoon so only picked up the e-mail last night. Thanks for the update. I shall wait and see if Lesley can change their minds about this location or not. In the meantime I will not look at this any further until I have some view from the Councillors. I hope there is a positive outcome.
I have copied David Armstrong into this e-mail so he is aware of the latest situation.
Regards,
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Stephens, Dan [mailto:DanStephens@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 08 September 2014 18:57 To: Timmins, Kieran; Ball, David S. Subject: RE: Greasby Councillors
Thanks Kieran,
David – to confirm Tom and Wendy were very clear that they would oppose the proposal. I will however speak to Lesley Rennie to establish how likely they would be to change their position given the alternative.
Regards,
Dan Stephens,
Chief Fire Officer,
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service,
Bridle Road,
Bootle,
Merseyside,
L30 4YD
0151 296 4102
07967371690
dan.stephens@mfrs.cjsm.net
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 08 September 2014 18:07 To: davidball@wiral.gov.uk Cc: Stephens, Dan Subject: Greasby Councillors
HI David
Not sure if you got the message earlier – Tried to catch you on the phone before you went to council meeting.
Dan met Greasby councillors today – Wendy Clements and Tom Anderson (I think). This as at request of Lesley rennie. They do not appear to like the idea of a fire station in Greasby and their initial thought is to oppose the plan based on the conversation today. Dan explained that the alternative option was the closure of West Kirby outright which was also not platable and may cause them to reconsider. However it appeared that their initial view is to oppose.
Can you give me a buzz on 07855 207571 if you want to discuss
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of the Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 10 September 2014 13:54 To: Stephens, Dan; Timmins, Kieran Subject: Meeting on friday re greasby and west Kirby
Dan/Kieran,
Just to confirm that David Armstrong and I will be attending the meeting at 4pm on Friday afternoon.
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
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Wirral Council planning on green belt fire station “inappropriate development” & “potential for significant harm”
Wirral Council planning on green belt fire station “inappropriate development” & “potential for significant harm”
Dan Stephens (Chief Fire Officer) answers questions at a public consultation meeting in Saughall Massie to discuss proposals for a new fire station (20th April 2015)
One of the long running sagas that this blog has reported on has been the future of Upton and West Kirby fire stations. Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service have had two twelve week consultations on this in the last year. The first consultation was on the controversial Greasby library/community centre site in the heart of Greasby village. However in a dramatic U-turn following opposition Wirral Council who owned the site in question withdrew it from consideration part way through the consultation.
The second consultation, which finished on the 18th May and provoked similar levels of opposition to that shown in Greasby but for different reasons also involved a piece of land in Wirral Council’s ownership in Saughall Massie. A decision by Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority following the second consultation is expected towards the end of June.
The emails make for interesting reading. As there are so many emails in three bundles of correspondence I may split this into different blog posts with half of the first bundle of emails below.
I haven’t included copies of the maps that were provided, however if you wish to view them, they’re on the Whatdotheyknow website. I haven’t corrected any typographical errors in the emails below.
Timmins, Kieran
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent:25 September 2013 18:31 To: NyreeCollinson@Merseyfire.gov.uk CC: Henshaw, Janet (Legal); Woods, Stewart; ColinSchofield@merseyfire.gov.uk Subject: Request for sites
Nyree, Please can you forward this to David Ball/David Armstrong at the Wirral. Thanks.
Thank you for a very useful meeting. As we discussed the authority has approved the attached report:-
A Strategic Overview of Estates – Identification of Key Priorities PDF 38Kb
To consider Report CFO/12/13 of the Deputy Chief Executive, concerning a review of the property portfolio of the Authority and recommendations for savings in light of the forecast significant reductions in funding. Additional documents
As I highlighted, we are currently at the exploratory stage of considerations and any firm decision about the future distribution of fire stations would require full authority approval. In order to assist me in taking back options for the Fire authority to consider Please can you:-
a) a suggest potential sites for a fire station in the Greasby area of the Wirral
b) Please can you suggest potential sites in the clatterbridge/bebington area
The approx. area for a stand alone fire station with community facilities is about 1 acre. At Prescot (which is likely to be a join police/fire ambulance station) we had identified a 2.4 acre site. Sites require good arterial road access for emergency response.
Many thanks
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
Timmins, Kieran From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 04 November 2013 13:39 To:‘davidball@wirral.gov.uk’;’davidarmstrong@wirral.gov.uk’ CC: Schofield, Colin Subject: FW: Request for sites
Hi Gents
Have you had a chance to consider what options might be available.
Regards
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
From: Collinson, Nyree Sent: 04 November 2013 12:52 To: Timmins, Kieran Subject: FW: Request for sites
Kieran, is this the email you’re looking for?
Nyree Collinson
PA to Deputy Chief Exec
Tel. 0151 296 4108
From: Collinson, Nyree Sent: 26 September 2013 09:36 To: David Ball – Regeneration Dept., Wirral Borough Council (davidball@wirral.gov.uk);’davidarmstrong@wirral.gov.uk’ Subject: FW: Request for sites
Please see below from Kieran Timmins
Nyree Collinson
PA to Deputy Chief Exec
Tel. 0151 296 4108
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 25 September 2013 18:31 To: Collinson, Nyree CC: Henshaw, Janet (Legal); Woods, Stewart; Schofield, Colin Subject: Request for sites
Dear David/David
Thank you for a very useful meeting. As we discussed the authority has approved the attached report:-
A Strategic Overview of Estates – Identification of Key Priorities PDF 38Kb
To consider Report CFO/12/13 of the Deputy Chief Executive, concerning a review of the property portfolio of the Authority and recommendations for savings in light of the forecast significant reductions in funding. Additional documents
As I highlighted, we are currently at the exploratory stage of considerations and any firm decision about the future distribution of fire stations would require full authority approval. In order to assist me in taking back options for the Fire authority to consider Please can you:-
a) a suggest potential sites for a fire station in the Greasby area of the Wirral
b) Please can you suggest potential sites in the clatterbridge/bebington area
The approx. area for a stand alone fire station with community facilities is about 1 acre. At Prescot (which is likely to be a join police/fire ambulance station) we had identified a 2.4 acre site. Sites require good arterial road access for emergency response.
Many thanks
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
Timmins, Kieran From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 15 November 2013 13:48 To:‘davidball@wirral.gov.uk’;’davidarmstrong@wirral.gov.uk’ CC: Schofield, Colin Subject: RE: Request for sites
Hi Gents
Have you had a chance to consider this yet?
Many thanks
Kieran
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 04 November 2013 13:39 To:‘davidball@wirral.gov.uk’;’davidarmstrong@wirral.gov.uk’ CC: Schofield, Colin Subject: FW: Request for sites
Hi Gents
Have you had a chance to consider what options might be available.
Regards
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
From: Collinson, Nyree Sent: 04 November 2013 12:52 To: Timmins, Kieran Subject: FW: Request for sites
Kieran, is this the email you’re looking for?
Nyree Collinson
PA to Deputy Chief Exec
Tel. 0151 296 4108
From: Collinson, Nyree Sent: 26 September 2013 09:36 To: David Ball – Regeneration Dept., Wirral Borough Council (davidball@wirral.gov.uk);’davidarmstrong@wirral.gov.uk’ Subject: FW: Request for sites
Please see below from Kieran Timmins
Nyree Collinson
PA to Deputy Chief Exec
Tel. 0151 296 4108
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 25 September 2013 18:31 To: Collinson, Nyree CC: Henshaw, Janet (Legal); Woods, Stewart; Schofield, Colin Subject: Request for sites
Dear David/David
Thank you for a very useful meeting. As we discussed the authority has approved the attached report:-
A Strategic Overview of Estates – Identification of Key Priorities PDF 38Kb
To consider Report CFO/12/13 of the Deputy Chief Executive, concerning a review of the property portfolio of the Authority and recommendations for savings in light of the forecast significant reductions in funding. Additional documents
As I highlighted, we are currently at the exploratory stage of considerations and any firm decision about the future distribution of fire stations would require full authority approval. In order to assist me in taking back options for the Fire authority to consider Please can you:-
a) a suggest potential sites for a fire station in the Greasby area of the Wirral
b) Please can you suggest potential sites in the clatterbridge/bebington area
The approx. area for a stand alone fire station with community facilities is about 1 acre. At Prescot (which is likely to be a join police/fire ambulance station) we had identified a 2.4 acre site. Sites require good arterial road access for emergency response.
Many thanks
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 15 November 2013 13:50 To: Timmins, Kieran Subject: Out of Office Autoreply: Request for sites
Thank you for your e-mail.
I am out of the office on Friday afternoon in a series of meetings. I will be accessing e-mails from time to time but if you need anything urgently then please contact Annie Hasprey or Melanie Sloan on 0151 691 8395 and they will be able to help you.
Regards,
David
David Ball
Head of Regeneration and Planning,
Wirral Council
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify
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Timmins, Kieran From: Halpin, Colleen S. on behalf of Armstrong, David Sent: 11 December 2013 14:55 To: Murphy(M), Paul; Timmins, Kieran; Schofield, Colin CC: Royle, Jeanette E. Subject: Request for Sites
Dear Colin, Paul and Kieran
Thank you for your emails and messages regarding a potential site in Greasby for a new fire station. I apologise for not replying sooner. I am afraid a new phone and a series of hospital appointments are slowing me down!
In order to discuss the Greasby site further, can you please contact Tony Simpson on tonysimpson@wirral.gov.uk, tell 666 3892, who will share with you the relevant plans and land ownership issues.
Regards
David Armstrong
Head of Universal Services CYPD
and Assistant Chief Executive
Colleen Halpin
PA to Director of Children’s Services
Children and Young People’s Department
Wirral Council
Tel: 0151 666 4288
Fax: 0151 666 4338
E-mail: colleenhalpin@wirral.gov.uk
www.wirral.gov.uk
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify
the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by
MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses.
www.clearswift.com
Timmins, Kieran
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 12 December 2013 09:58 To: ‘Armstrong, David’ Cc: Royle, Jeanette E.; Schofield, Colin Subject: RE: Request for Sites
Thanks David, much appreciated. Hope you are ok?
Not sure if Tony can pick this up but it strikes me as making sense if (presuming a Wirral owned site is identified in Greasby) that a land swap for the youth zone in Birkenhead might be a sensible approach for tidying up ownership etc…….. what do you think?
Take care
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
From: Halpin, Colleen S. on behalf of Armstrong, David Sent: 11 December 2013 14:55 To: Murphy(M), Paul; Timmins, Kieran; Schofield, Colin CC: Royle, Jeanette E. Subject: Request for Sites
Dear Colin, Paul and Kieran
Thank you for your emails and messages regarding a potential site in Greasby for a new fire station. I apologise for not replying sooner. I am afraid a new phone and a series of hospital appointments are slowing me down!
In order to discuss the Greasby site further, can you please contact Tony Simpson on tonysimpson@wirral.gov.uk, tell 666 3892, who will share with you the relevant plans and land ownership issues.
Regards
David Armstrong
Head of Universal Services CYPD
and Assistant Chief Executive
Colleen Halpin
PA to Director of Children’s Services
Children and Young People’s Department
Wirral Council
Tel: 0151 666 4288
Fax: 0151 666 4338
E-mail: colleenhalpin@wirral.gov.uk
www.wirral.gov.uk
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify
the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by
MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses.
www.clearswift.com
Timmins, Kieran From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 21 January 2014 11:06 To: ‘Armstrong, David’;Subramanayam, Anatha Cc: Schofield, Colin; Simpson, Tony Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Hi David
Thanks for the note….. to be very clear on the first point we expressly asked you to identify potential options. You certainly did not propose a site!
In relation to the other points I hope the comments below might help…..
The footprint we discussed was based upon the PFI stations we have built recently….. in general these are two bay with extensive community facilities. However in general most of the fire stations only house one appliance despite having two bays although we have been quite successful with the ambulance service in sharing sites.I can’t envisage us building an old style fire station without community facilities and would expect to have two bays as well to allow operational flexibility.
All three blue lights services have come under significant pressure to work more closely from government and I think there is a clear public expectation that in these challenging times for public services we would consider the possibility on any new build. In Merseyside we work very successfully with both NWAS and the Police and have several successful operations. In broad terms I would expect the presence of colleague services to be relatively small and not to add significantly to the building footprint (if it does suit their business plans). The PFI stations were designed prior to ambulance requests to move in but we have accommodated them without extension. There are lots of benefits for the local community around joint working by having the services co-located
Hope that is of use .Give me a buzz if you need to talk through anything
All the best
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure this email and attachments are free from virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify
the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by
MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses.
www.clearswift.com
From: Halpin, Colleen S. [mailto:ColleenHalpin@wirral.gov.uk] On Behalf Of Armstrong, David Sent: 21 January 2014 09:34 To: Subramanayam, Anatha Cc: Timmins, Kieran; Schofield, Colin; Simpson, Tony Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Thanks for this.
A couple of initial responses.
– I think it is important to be clear that I responded to a request from MFRS for possible sites for a fire station on council owned land. We came up with two, of which this was one, the other was felt by MFRS to be too close to the current Upton fire station. This is very different to how the email could be read that “David Armstrong proposed” this site. Clearly MFRS has the option to look also at other suitable sites owned by others.
– Our discussions were around a single bay fire station and in that regard the site appeared to have potential, particularly having the front and rear access required by MFRS. The discussion extended to possible inclusion of the community facilities, in line with the very positive developments undertaken by MFRS in Wallasey and Birkenhead.
– I’d envisage that a marked up drawing would come back showing if and how a one bay fire station would fit on the site and possibly a second option of a one bay plus a community facility.
– To the best of my memory, I don’t recall any mention of possible use by police and ambulance “hence the reason for two acres”. I fully support the principle, both for operational and financial reasons but would ask the question – is that going to result in us trying to squeeze a quart into a pint pot here.
– It would be useful to see the footprints of i) single bay fire station, ii) single bay fire station and community, iii) larger joint facility on the land in question.
Sorry if the above sounds negative – I just feel the need to be cautious!
Regards
David Armstrong
Head of Universal Services CYPD
and Assistant Chief Executive
Colleen Halpin
PA to Director of Children’s Services
Children and Young People’s Department
Wirral Council
Tel: 0151 666 4288
Fax: 0151 666 4338
E-mail: colleenhalpin@wirral.gov.uk www.wirral.gov.uk
From: Subramanayam, Anatha [mailto:] Sent: 20 January 2014 13:16 To: Simpson, Tony Cc: Schofield, Colin; Timmins, Kieran Subject: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC Importance: High
Hello Tony,
As per our meeting on 8th January 2014 – I am emailing you MFRS understanding in confidence about the land in Greasby (attached )
Summarising the way forward as we discussed:
WBC & MFRS discussed the criteria for development of the Fire station in the land proposed by David Armstrong of WBC as potential option.
You have confirmed that WBC have granted a long-term (99 year lease ) to the local community trust occupying the community centre adjacent to the site. Can you please confirm the area of the site we discussed :
1. With community centre
2. With community centre & Library
3. Without community centre and Library
You stated the approval was granted for the development of supermarket in the red cat premises Can please confirm whether the proposed scheme for Tesco/Sainsbury has been approved adjacent to the site Library which can expand the options available for WBC & MFRS to consider development on proposed sensitive site. (see attached drawing for reference)
As we have discussed with you MFRS anticipate greater interest from associated partners – NWAS & Mersey Police for their respective occupational requirements which is the reason we need minimum of 2 acres of Land to avoid any design issues for a feasible development.
As we discussed – ideally MFRS & WBC can look forward on few options :
1. MFRS can ideally build a Fire station in the proposed land subject to area confirmation.
2. MFRS can develop a Fire station in the proposed land along with community facility while transferring the lease agreements from WBC to MFRS for the existing community centre subject to consultation with community centre and area confirmation.
3. MFRS can develop a Fire station along with a community facility & Library facility within the associated occupant Lands subject to an agreement with WBC for Land and lease arrangements.
4. MFRS & WBC can work together to formulate development template in line with any Tesco/Sainsbury proposals in the adjacent Red Cat premises along with Option 3 mentioned above which can be beneficial to all involved stakeholders and community in general.
I look forward to your thoughts on above and please do not hesitate to contact us for any information needed.
Regards
Anu
Anatha Subramanayam | Development Manager – Estates | Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service | Bridle Road, Bootle L30 4YD | Office: 0151 296 4314 Mob: 07801156545 Email: anathasubramanayam@merseyfire.gov.uk
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Kieran, Timmins
From: Halpin, Colleen S. [mailto:ColleenHalpin@wirral.gov.uk] On Behalf Of Armstrong, David Sent: 21 January 2014 09:34 To: Subramanayam, Anatha Cc: Timmins, Kieran; Schofield, Colin; Simpson, Tony Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Thanks for this.
A couple of initial responses.
– I think it is important to be clear that I responded to a request from MFRS for possible sites for a fire station on council owned land. We came up with two, of which this was one, the other was felt by MFRS to be too close to the current Upton fire station. This is very different to how the email could be read that “David Armstrong proposed” this site. Clearly MFRS has the option to look also at other suitable sites owned by others.
– Our discussions were around a single bay fire station and in that regard the site appeared to have potential, particularly having the front and rear access required by MFRS. The discussion extended to possible inclusion of the community facilities, in line with the very positive developments undertaken by MFRS in Wallasey and Birkenhead.
– I’d envisage that a marked up drawing would come back showing if and how a one bay fire station would fit on the site and possibly a second option of a one bay plus a community facility.
– To the best of my memory, I don’t recall any mention of possible use by police and ambulance “hence the reason for two acres”. I fully support the principle, both for operational and financial reasons but would ask the question – is that going to result in us trying to squeeze a quart into a pint pot here.
– It would be useful to see the footprints of i) single bay fire station, ii) single bay fire station and community, iii) larger joint facility on the land in question.
Sorry if the above sounds negative – I just feel the need to be cautious!
Regards
David Armstrong
Head of Universal Services CYPD
and Assistant Chief Executive
Colleen Halpin
PA to Director of Children’s Services
Children and Young People’s Department
Wirral Council
Tel: 0151 666 4288
Fax: 0151 666 4338
E-mail: colleenhalpin@wirral.gov.uk www.wirral.gov.uk
From: Subramanayam, Anatha [mailto:] Sent: 20 January 2014 13:16 To: Simpson, Tony Cc: Schofield, Colin; Timmins, Kieran Subject: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC Importance: High
Hello Tony,
As per our meeting on 8th January 2014 – I am emailing you MFRS understanding in confidence about the land in Greasby (attached )
Summarising the way forward as we discussed:
WBC & MFRS discussed the criteria for development of the Fire station in the land proposed by David Armstrong of WBC as potential option.
You have confirmed that WBC have granted a long-term (99 year lease ) to the local community trust occupying the community centre adjacent to the site. Can you please confirm the area of the site we discussed :
1. With community centre
2. With community centre & Library
3. Without community centre and Library
You stated the approval was granted for the development of supermarket in the red cat premises Can please confirm whether the proposed scheme for Tesco/Sainsbury has been approved adjacent to the site Library which can expand the options available for WBC & MFRS to consider development on proposed sensitive site. (see attached drawing for reference)
As we have discussed with you MFRS anticipate greater interest from associated partners – NWAS & Mersey Police for their respective occupational requirements which is the reason we need minimum of 2 acres of Land to avoid any design issues for a feasible development.
As we discussed – ideally MFRS & WBC can look forward on few options :
1. MFRS can ideally build a Fire station in the proposed land subject to area confirmation.
2. MFRS can develop a Fire station in the proposed land along with community facility while transferring the lease agreements from WBC to MFRS for the existing community centre subject to consultation with community centre and area confirmation.
3. MFRS can develop a Fire station along with a community facility & Library facility within the associated occupant Lands subject to an agreement with WBC for Land and lease arrangements.
4. MFRS & WBC can work together to formulate development template in line with any Tesco/Sainsbury proposals in the adjacent Red Cat premises along with Option 3 mentioned above which can be beneficial to all involved stakeholders and community in general.
I look forward to your thoughts on above and please do not hesitate to contact us for any information needed.
Regards
Anu
Anatha Subramanayam | Development Manager – Estates | Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service | Bridle Road, Bootle L30 4YD | Office: 0151 296 4314 Mob: 07801156545 Email: anathasubramanayam@merseyfire.gov.uk
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
Timmins, Kieran
From: Simpson, Tony Sent: 25 March 2014 17:08 To:Timmins, Kieran Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Hi Kieran
Proprietor of Upton Cricket Club, Old Greasby Road, Wirral, CH49 6LT :-
Rose Chaplet Nominees Ltd., (Co. Regn. No.05678129), and Reveille Nominees Ltd., (Co. Regn. 05678115), c/o Leverhulme Estates, Estate Office, Thornton Hough, Wirral CH63 1JD and c/o Brabners LLP (Ref. JPW/AFR/LEO), Horton House, Exchange Flags, Liverpool L2 3YL
Regards
Tony
Timmins, Kieran From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 21 January 2014 11:06 To: ‘Armstrong, David’;Subramanayam, Anatha Cc: Schofield, Colin; Simpson, Tony Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Hi David
Thanks for the note….. to be very clear on the first point we expressly asked you to identify potential options. You certainly did not propose a site!
In relation to the other points I hope the comments below might help…..
The footprint we discussed was based upon the PFI stations we have built recently….. in general these are two bay with extensive community facilities. However in general most of the fire stations only house one appliance despite having two bays although we have been quite successful with the ambulance service in sharing sites.I can’t envisage us building an old style fire station without community facilities and would expect to have two bays as well to allow operational flexibility.
All three blue lights services have come under significant pressure to work more closely from government and I think there is a clear public expectation that in these challenging times for public services we would consider the possibility on any new build. In Merseyside we work very successfully with both NWAS and the Police and have several successful operations. In broad terms I would expect the presence of colleague services to be relatively small and not to add significantly to the building footprint (if it does suit their business plans). The PFI stations were designed prior to ambulance requests to move in but we have accommodated them without extension. There are lots of benefits for the local community around joint working by having the services co-located
Hope that is of use .Give me a buzz if you need to talk through anything
All the best
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
From: Halpin, Colleen S. [mailto:ColleenHalpin@wirral.gov.uk] On Behalf Of Armstrong, David Sent: 21 January 2014 09:34 To: Subramanayam, Anatha Cc: Timmins, Kieran; Schofield, Colin; Simpson, Tony Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Thanks for this.
A couple of initial responses.
– I think it is important to be clear that I responded to a request from MFRS for possible sites for a fire station on council owned land. We came up with two, of which this was one, the other was felt by MFRS to be too close to the current Upton fire station. This is very different to how the email could be read that “David Armstrong proposed” this site. Clearly MFRS has the option to look also at other suitable sites owned by others.
– Our discussions were around a single bay fire station and in that regard the site appeared to have potential, particularly having the front and rear access required by MFRS. The discussion extended to possible inclusion of the community facilities, in line with the very positive developments undertaken by MFRS in Wallasey and Birkenhead.
– I’d envisage that a marked up drawing would come back showing if and how a one bay fire station would fit on the site and possibly a second option of a one bay plus a community facility.
– To the best of my memory, I don’t recall any mention of possible use by police and ambulance “hence the reason for two acres”. I fully support the principle, both for operational and financial reasons but would ask the question – is that going to result in us trying to squeeze a quart into a pint pot here.
– It would be useful to see the footprints of i) single bay fire station, ii) single bay fire station and community, iii) larger joint facility on the land in question.
Sorry if the above sounds negative – I just feel the need to be cautious!
Regards
David Armstrong
Head of Universal Services CYPD
and Assistant Chief Executive
Colleen Halpin
PA to Director of Children’s Services
Children and Young People’s Department
Wirral Council
Tel: 0151 666 4288
Fax: 0151 666 4338
E-mail: colleenhalpin@wirral.gov.uk www.wirral.gov.uk
From: Subramanayam, Anatha [mailto:] Sent: 20 January 2014 13:16 To: Simpson, Tony Cc: Schofield, Colin; Timmins, Kieran Subject: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC Importance: High
Hello Tony,
As per our meeting on 8th January 2014 – I am emailing you MFRS understanding in confidence about the land in Greasby (attached )
Summarising the way forward as we discussed:
WBC & MFRS discussed the criteria for development of the Fire station in the land proposed by David Armstrong of WBC as potential option.
You have confirmed that WBC have granted a long-term (99 year lease ) to the local community trust occupying the community centre adjacent to the site. Can you please confirm the area of the site we discussed :
1. With community centre
2. With community centre & Library
3. Without community centre and Library
You stated the approval was granted for the development of supermarket in the red cat premises Can please confirm whether the proposed scheme for Tesco/Sainsbury has been approved adjacent to the site Library which can expand the options available for WBC & MFRS to consider development on proposed sensitive site. (see attached drawing for reference)
As we have discussed with you MFRS anticipate greater interest from associated partners – NWAS & Mersey Police for their respective occupational requirements which is the reason we need minimum of 2 acres of Land to avoid any design issues for a feasible development.
As we discussed – ideally MFRS & WBC can look forward on few options :
1. MFRS can ideally build a Fire station in the proposed land subject to area confirmation.
2. MFRS can develop a Fire station in the proposed land along with community facility while transferring the lease agreements from WBC to MFRS for the existing community centre subject to consultation with community centre and area confirmation.
3. MFRS can develop a Fire station along with a community facility & Library facility within the associated occupant Lands subject to an agreement with WBC for Land and lease arrangements.
4. MFRS & WBC can work together to formulate development template in line with any Tesco/Sainsbury proposals in the adjacent Red Cat premises along with Option 3 mentioned above which can be beneficial to all involved stakeholders and community in general.
I look forward to your thoughts on above and please do not hesitate to contact us for any information needed.
Regards
Anu
Anatha Subramanayam | Development Manager – Estates | Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service | Bridle Road, Bootle L30 4YD | Office: 0151 296 4314 Mob: 07801156545 Email: anathasubramanayam@merseyfire.gov.uk
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify
the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.clearswift.com
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
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Timmins, Kieran
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 25 March 2014 17:10 To: ‘Simpson, Tony’ Cc: Subramanayam, Anatha; Schofield, Colin; Woods, Stewart Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Thanks for prompt research Tony….. although just looking at the listing makes me think this could be complicated!!
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
From: Simpson, Tony Sent: 25 March 2014 17:08 To:Timmins, Kieran Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Hi Kieran
Proprietor of Upton Cricket Club, Old Greasby Road, Wirral, CH49 6LT :-
Rose Chaplet Nominees Ltd., (Co. Regn. No.05678129), and Reveille Nominees Ltd., (Co. Regn. 05678115), c/o Leverhulme Estates, Estate Office, Thornton Hough, Wirral CH63 1JD and c/o Brabners LLP (Ref. JPW/AFR/LEO), Horton House, Exchange Flags, Liverpool L2 3YL
Regards
Tony
Timmins, Kieran From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 21 January 2014 11:06 To: ‘Armstrong, David’;Subramanayam, Anatha Cc: Schofield, Colin; Simpson, Tony Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Hi David
Thanks for the note….. to be very clear on the first point we expressly asked you to identify potential options. You certainly did not propose a site!
In relation to the other points I hope the comments below might help…..
The footprint we discussed was based upon the PFI stations we have built recently….. in general these are two bay with extensive community facilities. However in general most of the fire stations only house one appliance despite having two bays although we have been quite successful with the ambulance service in sharing sites.I can’t envisage us building an old style fire station without community facilities and would expect to have two bays as well to allow operational flexibility.
All three blue lights services have come under significant pressure to work more closely from government and I think there is a clear public expectation that in these challenging times for public services we would consider the possibility on any new build. In Merseyside we work very successfully with both NWAS and the Police and have several successful operations. In broad terms I would expect the presence of colleague services to be relatively small and not to add significantly to the building footprint (if it does suit their business plans). The PFI stations were designed prior to ambulance requests to move in but we have accommodated them without extension. There are lots of benefits for the local community around joint working by having the services co-located
Hope that is of use .Give me a buzz if you need to talk through anything
All the best
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
From: Halpin, Colleen S. [mailto:ColleenHalpin@wirral.gov.uk] On Behalf Of Armstrong, David Sent: 21 January 2014 09:34 To: Subramanayam, Anatha Cc: Timmins, Kieran; Schofield, Colin; Simpson, Tony Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Thanks for this.
A couple of initial responses.
– I think it is important to be clear that I responded to a request from MFRS for possible sites for a fire station on council owned land. We came up with two, of which this was one, the other was felt by MFRS to be too close to the current Upton fire station. This is very different to how the email could be read that “David Armstrong proposed” this site. Clearly MFRS has the option to look also at other suitable sites owned by others.
– Our discussions were around a single bay fire station and in that regard the site appeared to have potential, particularly having the front and rear access required by MFRS. The discussion extended to possible inclusion of the community facilities, in line with the very positive developments undertaken by MFRS in Wallasey and Birkenhead.
– I’d envisage that a marked up drawing would come back showing if and how a one bay fire station would fit on the site and possibly a second option of a one bay plus a community facility.
– To the best of my memory, I don’t recall any mention of possible use by police and ambulance “hence the reason for two acres”. I fully support the principle, both for operational and financial reasons but would ask the question – is that going to result in us trying to squeeze a quart into a pint pot here.
– It would be useful to see the footprints of i) single bay fire station, ii) single bay fire station and community, iii) larger joint facility on the land in question.
Sorry if the above sounds negative – I just feel the need to be cautious!
Regards
David Armstrong
Head of Universal Services CYPD
and Assistant Chief Executive
Colleen Halpin
PA to Director of Children’s Services
Children and Young People’s Department
Wirral Council
Tel: 0151 666 4288
Fax: 0151 666 4338
E-mail: colleenhalpin@wirral.gov.uk www.wirral.gov.uk
From: Subramanayam, Anatha [mailto:] Sent: 20 January 2014 13:16 To: Simpson, Tony Cc: Schofield, Colin; Timmins, Kieran Subject: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC Importance: High
Hello Tony,
As per our meeting on 8th January 2014 – I am emailing you MFRS understanding in confidence about the land in Greasby (attached )
Summarising the way forward as we discussed:
WBC & MFRS discussed the criteria for development of the Fire station in the land proposed by David Armstrong of WBC as potential option.
You have confirmed that WBC have granted a long-term (99 year lease ) to the local community trust occupying the community centre adjacent to the site. Can you please confirm the area of the site we discussed :
1. With community centre
2. With community centre & Library
3. Without community centre and Library
You stated the approval was granted for the development of supermarket in the red cat premises Can please confirm whether the proposed scheme for Tesco/Sainsbury has been approved adjacent to the site Library which can expand the options available for WBC & MFRS to consider development on proposed sensitive site. (see attached drawing for reference)
As we have discussed with you MFRS anticipate greater interest from associated partners – NWAS & Mersey Police for their respective occupational requirements which is the reason we need minimum of 2 acres of Land to avoid any design issues for a feasible development.
As we discussed – ideally MFRS & WBC can look forward on few options :
1. MFRS can ideally build a Fire station in the proposed land subject to area confirmation.
2. MFRS can develop a Fire station in the proposed land along with community facility while transferring the lease agreements from WBC to MFRS for the existing community centre subject to consultation with community centre and area confirmation.
3. MFRS can develop a Fire station along with a community facility & Library facility within the associated occupant Lands subject to an agreement with WBC for Land and lease arrangements.
4. MFRS & WBC can work together to formulate development template in line with any Tesco/Sainsbury proposals in the adjacent Red Cat premises along with Option 3 mentioned above which can be beneficial to all involved stakeholders and community in general.
I look forward to your thoughts on above and please do not hesitate to contact us for any information needed.
Regards
Anu
Anatha Subramanayam | Development Manager – Estates | Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service | Bridle Road, Bootle L30 4YD | Office: 0151 296 4314 Mob: 07801156545 Email: anathasubramanayam@merseyfire.gov.uk
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
Timmins, Kieran
From: Simpson, Tony Sent: 25 March 2014 17:14 To: Timmins, Kieran Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Nothing’s ever easy these days!
Timmins, Kieran
From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 25 March 2014 17:10 To: ‘Simpson, Tony’ Cc: Subramanayam, Anatha; Schofield, Colin; Woods, Stewart Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Thanks for prompt research Tony….. although just looking at the listing makes me think this could be complicated!!
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
kierantimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk
www.merseyfire.gov.uk
From: Simpson, Tony Sent: 25 March 2014 17:08 To:Timmins, Kieran Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Hi Kieran
Proprietor of Upton Cricket Club, Old Greasby Road, Wirral, CH49 6LT :-
Rose Chaplet Nominees Ltd., (Co. Regn. No.05678129), and Reveille Nominees Ltd., (Co. Regn. 05678115), c/o Leverhulme Estates, Estate Office, Thornton Hough, Wirral CH63 1JD and c/o Brabners LLP (Ref. JPW/AFR/LEO), Horton House, Exchange Flags, Liverpool L2 3YL
Regards
Tony
Timmins, Kieran From: Timmins, Kieran Sent: 21 January 2014 11:06 To: ‘Armstrong, David’;Subramanayam, Anatha Cc: Schofield, Colin; Simpson, Tony Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Hi David
Thanks for the note….. to be very clear on the first point we expressly asked you to identify potential options. You certainly did not propose a site!
In relation to the other points I hope the comments below might help…..
The footprint we discussed was based upon the PFI stations we have built recently….. in general these are two bay with extensive community facilities. However in general most of the fire stations only house one appliance despite having two bays although we have been quite successful with the ambulance service in sharing sites.I can’t envisage us building an old style fire station without community facilities and would expect to have two bays as well to allow operational flexibility.
All three blue lights services have come under significant pressure to work more closely from government and I think there is a clear public expectation that in these challenging times for public services we would consider the possibility on any new build. In Merseyside we work very successfully with both NWAS and the Police and have several successful operations. In broad terms I would expect the presence of colleague services to be relatively small and not to add significantly to the building footprint (if it does suit their business plans). The PFI stations were designed prior to ambulance requests to move in but we have accommodated them without extension. There are lots of benefits for the local community around joint working by having the services co-located
Hope that is of use .Give me a buzz if you need to talk through anything
All the best
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
From: Halpin, Colleen S. [mailto:ColleenHalpin@wirral.gov.uk] On Behalf Of Armstrong, David Sent: 21 January 2014 09:34 To: Subramanayam, Anatha Cc: Timmins, Kieran; Schofield, Colin; Simpson, Tony Subject: RE: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC
Thanks for this.
A couple of initial responses.
– I think it is important to be clear that I responded to a request from MFRS for possible sites for a fire station on council owned land. We came up with two, of which this was one, the other was felt by MFRS to be too close to the current Upton fire station. This is very different to how the email could be read that “David Armstrong proposed” this site. Clearly MFRS has the option to look also at other suitable sites owned by others.
– Our discussions were around a single bay fire station and in that regard the site appeared to have potential, particularly having the front and rear access required by MFRS. The discussion extended to possible inclusion of the community facilities, in line with the very positive developments undertaken by MFRS in Wallasey and Birkenhead.
– I’d envisage that a marked up drawing would come back showing if and how a one bay fire station would fit on the site and possibly a second option of a one bay plus a community facility.
– To the best of my memory, I don’t recall any mention of possible use by police and ambulance “hence the reason for two acres”. I fully support the principle, both for operational and financial reasons but would ask the question – is that going to result in us trying to squeeze a quart into a pint pot here.
– It would be useful to see the footprints of i) single bay fire station, ii) single bay fire station and community, iii) larger joint facility on the land in question.
Sorry if the above sounds negative – I just feel the need to be cautious!
Regards
David Armstrong
Head of Universal Services CYPD
and Assistant Chief Executive
Colleen Halpin
PA to Director of Children’s Services
Children and Young People’s Department
Wirral Council
Tel: 0151 666 4288
Fax: 0151 666 4338
E-mail: colleenhalpin@wirral.gov.uk www.wirral.gov.uk
From: Subramanayam, Anatha [mailto:] Sent: 20 January 2014 13:16 To: Simpson, Tony Cc: Schofield, Colin; Timmins, Kieran Subject: Greasby Land – MFRS/WBC Importance: High
Hello Tony,
As per our meeting on 8th January 2014 – I am emailing you MFRS understanding in confidence about the land in Greasby (attached )
Summarising the way forward as we discussed:
WBC & MFRS discussed the criteria for development of the Fire station in the land proposed by David Armstrong of WBC as potential option.
You have confirmed that WBC have granted a long-term (99 year lease ) to the local community trust occupying the community centre adjacent to the site. Can you please confirm the area of the site we discussed :
1. With community centre
2. With community centre & Library
3. Without community centre and Library
You stated the approval was granted for the development of supermarket in the red cat premises Can please confirm whether the proposed scheme for Tesco/Sainsbury has been approved adjacent to the site Library which can expand the options available for WBC & MFRS to consider development on proposed sensitive site. (see attached drawing for reference)
As we have discussed with you MFRS anticipate greater interest from associated partners – NWAS & Mersey Police for their respective occupational requirements which is the reason we need minimum of 2 acres of Land to avoid any design issues for a feasible development.
As we discussed – ideally MFRS & WBC can look forward on few options :
1. MFRS can ideally build a Fire station in the proposed land subject to area confirmation.
2. MFRS can develop a Fire station in the proposed land along with community facility while transferring the lease agreements from WBC to MFRS for the existing community centre subject to consultation with community centre and area confirmation.
3. MFRS can develop a Fire station along with a community facility & Library facility within the associated occupant Lands subject to an agreement with WBC for Land and lease arrangements.
4. MFRS & WBC can work together to formulate development template in line with any Tesco/Sainsbury proposals in the adjacent Red Cat premises along with Option 3 mentioned above which can be beneficial to all involved stakeholders and community in general.
I look forward to your thoughts on above and please do not hesitate to contact us for any information needed.
Regards
Anu
Anatha Subramanayam | Development Manager – Estates | Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service | Bridle Road, Bootle L30 4YD | Office: 0151 296 4314 Mob: 07801156545 Email: anathasubramanayam@merseyfire.gov.uk
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the originator of the message.
Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies and with authority, states them to be the views of Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service, (MFRS) .
Incoming and outgoing emails may be monitored in line with current legislation.
Steps have been taken to ensure that this email and attachments are free from any virus. In keeping with good computing practice the recipient should ensure they are actually virus free.
http://www.merseyfire.gov.uk/
Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 29 April 2014 09:06 To: Timmins, Kieran Cc: Simpson, Tony; Armstrong, David Subject: RE: Greasby sites
Kieran,
I don’t but I have copied this to Tony and David who may know more about it.
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Timmins, Kieran [mailto:KieranTimmins@merseyfire.gov.uk] Sent: 29 April 2014 08:54 To: Ball, David S. Subject: Greasby sites
Hi David
Do you know anything about land sited on Frankby road opposite St John the divine church? Is that a possible fire station site?
Cheers
Kieran
Kieran Timmins
Deputy Chief Executive
Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority
Fire Service HQ
Bridle Road
Bootle
L30 4YD
Tel: 0151 296 4202
Fax: 0151 296 4224
Timmins, Kieran
From: Ball, David S Sent: 29 April 2014 12:58 To: Timmins, Kieran Cc: Armstrong, David; Simpson, Tony Subject FW: Greasby sites
Kieran,
Here is the view on this site from my Forward Planning team. It seems that there would be some planning policy issues here but I can explore it further if you want me to.
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
From: Entwhistle, John C. Sent: 29 April 2014 12:56 To: Ball, David S. Subject: RE: Greasby sites
David – the land on the opposite site of Frankby road to St John the Divine is in the Green Belt so a fire station would be inappropriate development and very special circumstances would have to be demonstrated. However there is potential for significant harm to the Green Belt in this location because of its role in maintaining separation between Greasby and Frankby.
John Entwistle Principal Forward Planning Officer,
Forward Planning,
Regeneration and Environment,
Wirral Council,
Town Hall, Brighton Street
Wallasey, Merseyside
CH44 8ED
Telephone: 0151 691 8221
email: johnentwistle@wirral.gov.uk
Fax: 0151 691 8273
Visit our website www.wirral.gov.uk
Please save paper and print out only what is necessary.
From: Ball, David S. Sent: 29 April 2014 12:19 To: Entwhistle, John C. Subject: FW: Greasby sites Importance: High
John,
Do we know anything about this site?
Would a fire station be an acceptable use?
David
DAVID BALL
Head of Regeneration and Planning
Regeneration and Environment Department
Wirral Council
Saughall Massie residents ask Wirral Council for reasons why greenbelt site suggested for new fire station
Saughall Massie residents ask Wirral Council for reasons why greenbelt site suggested for new fire station
Dan Stephens (Chief Fire Officer) answers questions at a public consultation meeting in Saughall Massie to discuss proposals for a new fire station (20th April 2015)
Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service consultation meeting Saughall Massie 20th April 2015 Part 3 of 4
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Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service consultation meeting Saughall Massie 20th April 2015 Part 4 of 4
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A member of the audience asked why Upton fire station couldn’t just be enlarged? Dan Stephens replied that if they did that, then it would increase response times to the West Kirby station area. He repeated what he had said earlier about how they couldn’t afford two fire stations and it was best to have one as close to the middle of the two existing fire stations as they could get.
Someone asked whether a completed risk assessment had been carried out on the impact on traffic of a new fire station in Saughall Massie? The answer was that such issues would be picked up in a future planning application. The Chief Fire Officer pointed out again that the roads in Wirral were no more challenging than roads elsewhere in Merseyside.
The next woman brought up environmental issues, heritage issues, property prices and said “my life will be definitely be blighted by this fire station” and she wanted to know “how it’s going to affect me here”. The Chief Fire Officer explained that his role was to be held to account for community safety matters. He said that the issues she had raised were ones for a planning committee to consider.
She asked a further question about why the proposal in Greasby had been thrown out and whether that was planning? The Chief Officer answered “No” and explained that they hadn’t got to the planning stage at Greasby. He added that they didn’t own the land at Greasby and the offer of the land had been withdrawn. Such questions would have to be asked of Wirral Council.
David Armstrong (Wirral Council) answered that the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority had approached Wirral Council to find a site. Three sites were identified in a built up area, one of which was the one in Greasby. That site didn’t go ahead “for a number of reasons” so they broadened the search out.
Mr Armstrong was next asked what the reasons were that they hadn’t proceeded with the Greasby site. Councillor Chris Blakeley gave his opinion that he thought the Council wanted to “make politics out of it”. Kieran Timmins chairing the meeting reminded Councillor Blakeley that it was not a political meeting.
“What reasons?” was asked again of David Armstrong. He answered, “As the idea developed, as the feedback came from the consultation meetings, as we looked at it more closely and we tried to explore it with the community centre who didn’t sign up to it at all. We looked into issues of grant which we’d had government grant to extend the library and the children’s centre et cetera, et cetera it became obvious that that scheme was not going to work. It was still important to have the consultation which you’re having now. The Council has done no more than cooperate with the fire service to have discussion about the fire safety of 26,000 people.
We started out looking at the sites that weren’t greenbelt and weren’t green space. There were three in Greasby. One was a triangular piece of land next to the cricket club that the Council owned which didn’t work because the fire service for understandable reasons like to have a site where they can take the fire tender in, drive it in, they need a substantial sized site.
We looked at a piece of land that the Council owns next to the second roundabout, not the Sainsburys one, the one nearest Greasby which has a dead-end spur into a piece of land. It’s leased to the Woodland Trust for 100 years. It’s very close to Upton, it didn’t give the fire service the location it needed.
That left us then with the Greasby site. When it became apparent that that wasn’t going to work, we broadened the search out we looked at the greenbelt sites and we presented them to the Fire Authority and that’s all we’ve done to have this discussion and debate because as Dan [Stephens] said earlier the decision will have to be made at the end of the day as to whether that can work in terms of fire safety, whether it would work for the people that live there and all those things would have to be brought together.
The Council has yet to reach a decision on whether to release the land, it will await the outcome of this consultation, that will feed into things and a report that will go to Council. If the Fire Authority wish to pursue this option because they’ve got that decision to make, if they do that, if the Fire Authority come back to the Council and say this is the only option, we’d like to pursue this, the Council will have to make a decision whether or not to release the site.
If the Council did decide to release the site, the Fire Authority then would have to apply for planning permission and an entirely separate process within the Council and that again would address all the issues, the environmental issues, the location issues, the planning issues as well.”
Saughall Massie residents express their opposition to fire station plans at first consultation meeting
Saughall Massie residents express their opposition to fire station plans at first consultation meeting
Dan Stephens (Chief Fire Officer) answers questions at a public consultation meeting in Saughall Massie to discuss proposals for a new fire station (20th April 2015)
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Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service consultation meeting Saughall Massie 20th April 2015 Part 1 of 4
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Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service consultation meeting Saughall Massie 20th April 2015 Part 2 of 4
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Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service consultation meeting Saughall Massie 20th April 2015 Part 3 of 4
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Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service consultation meeting Saughall Massie 20th April 2015 Part 4 of 4
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Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service consultation meeting Saughall Massie 20th April 2015 Playlist of all parts 1-4
A consultation meeting in Saughall Massie to hear from the public on a proposed new fire station in Saughall Massie Road started badly when over a hundred people who came to the meeting were turned away from the St Marys Centre because the meeting was full. Despite repeated requests at the start of the meeting by a local councillor for a further meeting in Saughall Massie, Dan Stephens (Chief Fire Officer) refused to commit himself to a further public meeting however did say it was something he would “carefully consider”.
The Chief Fire Officer explained that if Upton and West Kirby fire stations were closed, then in his view (although people didn’t have to agree with him) a new fire station would be needed near the midpoint of the two existing fire stations. If a new fire station wasn’t built in Saughall Massie and only West Kirby fire station was closed, then it would lead to an increase in response times to the former West Kirby station area. He made it clear that after the consultation was finished the final decision on what happens next would be taken by the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority, who would have to consider public safety and response times. The views expressed at the public consultation meetings would be reported back to the Fire Authority.
The first person who asked a question felt that gridlock in the roads around Saughall Massie at certain times and narrow roads would lead to an increase in response times if a new fire station was built in Saughall Massie. The Chief Fire Officer responded that he felt the traffic conditions “were no worse than they are anywhere else on Merseyside”.
Continuing with his question the same person pointed out that twice a day the road from Saughall Massie to West Kirby was blocked by cattle being moved between fields. He suggested that they look for brownfield sites instead.
The Chief Fire Officer explained that they didn’t have compulsory purchase powers and that as they’d already been through a consultation on Greasby that the matters needed to be resolved. He said that if West Kirby fire station was closed and Upton kept open, then the fire engines (from Upton) would need to travel down the same roads to the West Kirby area.
Another member of the public pointed out that the number of incidents responded to by the fire service was falling year on year. She asked if Upton fire station could be used for less callouts?
Dan Stephens replied that it wasn’t the number of incidents that was important but the type of the incident. There were 26,000 people living in the West Kirby station area, therefore “it’s an absolute certainty we will have another domestic property fire”. In his view it didn’t matter that the total number of incidents were going down, but as long as people lived there, there would be incidents. He said, “It’s about run times, not numbers of incidents.”
The next person to ask a question pointed out that the map showing response times of Saughall Massie versus Upton showed that from Upton, an over 10 minute response time would be mainly to fields and a golf course. Replying to his point, the Chief Fire Officer said that there was still a good proportion that was an 8 to 9 minute response time compared to only 6 to 7 minutes from Saughall Massie.
A resident of Saughall Massie said that she wasn’t in agreement with a new fire station in Saughall Massie and that “if you feel that that’s the best place you have to prove it to everybody”. Dan Stephens replied that they couldn’t afford two fire stations, but could only have one. That one fire station would have to be in the middle.
The next question was from the secretary of the Saughall Massie Conservation Area Society. He said he was not going to talk about conservation or greenbelt, but response. His question was if BRVs (brigade response vehicles) would be considered? The Chief Fire Officer explained that the brigade response vehicles weren’t of much use in responding to a domestic property fire or a road traffic collision. He pointed out that West Midlands Fire and Rescue Authority could afford BRVs, but Merseyside Fire and Rescue Authority couldn’t. BRVs were for antisocial small fires, but would have to be manned by three extra people that they couldn’t afford.
A further question asked was why couldn’t the council tax that pays for the fire service on Merseyside be increased by £5? The answer given was that to do that would require a referendum which would cost an estimated £2 million.
The Chief Fire Officer was then asked if he would consider other options such as BRVs? He said he would not consider them as they “give me absolutely nothing in terms of operational response” and that he would be “paying for an asset that gave me absolutely nothing”.
The next woman referred to a petition about the closure of West Kirby fire station and speculation about plans for a multi-storey shopping centre there. Dan Stephens said that there had been no consideration of the disposal of the site at West Kirby because no decision had yet been made to close it. The same woman referred to the “Greater Concourse plan”. David Armstrong (Assistant Chief Executive, Wirral Council) said that “there are no current plans for anything at the West Kirby site”.
