Cllr John Salter | A blog about Wirral Council, Wirral Council's councillors & officers

Labour councillor bans filming at public meeting to decide whether to licence a taxi that’s over 10 years old

Last Thursday there was a public meeting of Wirral Council’s Licensing, Health and Safety and General Purposes Committee. Part of this meeting considered an item deferred from a Licensing Panel the week before.

The report on that item titled HACKNEY CARRIAGE VEHICLE LICENCE APPLICATION – LTI TXII REGISTRATION NUMBER WX03 FPE can be read by following this link.

The application was for a hackney carriage vehicle that is 12 years old.

In August 2014, new regulations came into force that prevent councils stopping filming at public meetings.

Below is a transcript of what happened at the Licensing, Health and Safety and General Purposes Committee meeting on the 25th March 2015. It shows that Wirral Council still thinks it has the power to stop filming at public meetings.

Derek Cummins is a union representative in the UNITE union. Margaret O’Donnell works for Wirral Council.

Councillor Bill Davies gets irate and starts wagging his finger when he's told he can't ban filming any more Licensing, Health and Safety and General Purposes Committee 25th March 2015 — Councillor Bill Davies gets irate and starts wagging his finger when he’s told he can’t ban filming any more Licensing, Health and Safety and General Purposes Committee 25th March 2015

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Licensing, Health and Safety and General Purposes Committee (Wirral Council) 25th March 2015

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): The next item, the last item is… Margaret? Do you want to come forward sir?

CLLR TOM ANDERSON: Is this exempt?

CLLR JOHN SALTER: Are we exempted?

CLLR STEVE NIBLOCK: Can we ask for legal clarification about whether or not this item should be exempt because it might be to do with personal or financial circumstances with regard to this application and I’d prefer that we should consider whether it was exempt?

LEGAL ADVISOR TO COMMITTEE: I think we need to clarify whether or not there’s an objection first from the individual before we determine whether or not a decision needs to be made in that respect.

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): Are you objecting sir?

TAXI DRIVER: Well, yeah sorry, are you talking about my finance?

DEREK CUMMINS: He didn’t quite understand. Yeah, if it’s possible.

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): If you’ll just come forward.

TAXI DRIVER: Sorry.

MARGARET O’DONNELL: Just stay there.

CLLR JOHN SALTER: Yeah, just, just keep, yeah sorry, so you don’t, you’re not identified at the present time.

DEREK CUMMINS: Yeah, just to be confident it’s that disagreement on the internet, I don’t want for, for the, could we just sort of err stop filming this side? Well I would suggest it.

CLLR MICHAEL SULLIVAN: Yes, he said stop filming.

UNKNOWN COUNCILLOR: Stop filming.

CLLR JOHN SALTER: So do it under 12A!

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): You don’t want to be filmed or recorded?

TAXI DRIVER: I’m ok, it’s just err on the finance.

CLLR JOHN SALTER: Yeah.

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): There’s finance involved?

CLLRS STEVE NIBLOCK AND CLLRS JOHN SALTER: Yeah.

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): Right you cannot be filmed because finances are going to be involved.

JOHN BRACE: Sorry did he say he was ok with being filmed but we’re going to be excluded anyway?

DEREK CUMMINS: Yeah, he did.

JOHN BRACE: In a bit yeah? That’s fine, but they’ve got to agree the exclusion first.

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): I can’t, I can’t hear from up here, would someone, would someone?

MARGARET O’DONNELL: Can I assist? Firstly, err Derek are you representing the applicant?

DEREK CUMMINS: He didn’t come to me at all, it’s just he doesn’t quite understand what the agenda is.

CLLR MICHAEL SULLIVAN: We’re concerned about you being filmed and disclosing personal information.

DEREK CUMMINS: That goes on the internet.

CLLR MICHAEL SULLIVAN: That could very well end up on the internet

OTHER COUNCILLOR: Yeah.

CLLR MICHAEL SULLIVAN: and on Youtube.

DEREK CUMMINS: So you’d rather have that handled?

TAXI DRIVER: No, yeah. Yeah.

CLLR MICHAEL SULLIVAN: We’re trying to protect your interests so you’re alright.

TAXI DRIVER: Thank you.

DEREK CUMMINS: So there’s a thing called 7A so we’re excluded, everyone’s excluded, except you.

CLLR MICHAEL SULLIVAN: So would you be happier if we just said no filming?

TAXI DRIVER: Please.

CLLR JOHN SALTER: Yes.

TAXI DRIVER: Please.

CLLR JOHN SALTER: Yes Chair.

JOHN BRACE: If they’re excluding the public then it doesn’t matter.

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): Sorry, it’s not an exempt item. The person can stay but they don’t film.

JOHN BRACE: I’m getting confused now. Sorry are you excluding members of the public or not?

CLLR BILL DAVIES (and other councillors): No, no, no, no.

CLLR MICHAEL SULLIVAN: But you can’t film.

JOHN BRACE: But the reason….

CLLR BILL DAVIES: He’s an individual, if he’s got human rights like everybody else. He doesn’t want to be filmed, he doesn’t want to be filmed.

JOHN BRACE: I was just going to point out that although we had this discussion a lot longer at Standards

CLLR DAVID ELDERTON: Please take it down and take it out.

JOHN BRACE: Sorry can I finish what I’m saying? Err, I thought you were about to say you were going to exclude the members of the press and public and he was going to stay and you were just going to decide that, but now you’re saying you’re going to decide, if you’re going to decide this when the press and public are going to be here then the regulations say that any bit of the meeting that’s public can be filmed but obviously if we were excluded then we can’t film it.

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): Well the gentleman there does not want to be filmed.

JOHN BRACE: Yeah but I can film the other side of the room?

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): That’s what he’s saying. I think that’s quite clear! Some of us don’t want to be filmed. At the end of the day, if it ends up on the internet or Youtube this committee and the officers and something goes wrong will be responsible. It won’t be you, it will be us and this man has said, do you want that recorded. Do you want to be filmed or recorded?

TAXI DRIVER: No.

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): That’s fine. You can stay but you don’t film or record. I have made it quite clear because the gentleman, if the gentleman wants to be filmed, no problem. He doesn’t.

JOHN BRACE: OK.

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): OK.

CLLR DAVID ELDERTON: It is the Chair’s discretion.

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): Yep. OK.

CLLR JOHN SALTER: Will you switch it off?

JOHN BRACE: At the Standards Committee it was said if you’re going make a decision that filming is not allowed, then you record that in the minutes with the reasons.

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): Yeah, I will do that.

JOHN BRACE: OK, could you give..

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): but we’re not at the Standards Committee, we’re at the Licensing Committee.

JOHN BRACE: Yeah, I know, but just

CLLR BILL DAVIES (Chair): but you must realise that there’s certain times when individuals have private, personal or financial and they do not want their business spread elsewhere.

JOHN BRACE: I’ll just say I’d like that recorded in the minutes and if that’s the case then I’ll stop filming because I want to challenge that anyway under the regulations so that’s my position.

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Once the camera was switched off and the lens cover was shut, councillors went back on what they’d said and excluded the press and public from the rest of the meeting anyway!

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Why are Wirral councillors trying to kill off press freedom by a new public meetings filming ban?

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Video of the Standards and Constitutional Oversight Committee from 3rd March 2015, the item on filming starts 43 seconds into the meeting

Surjit Tour (Monitoring Officer at Wirral Council) gives councillors his opinion at the meeting that he doesn't think the draft policy banning filming breaches the Human Rights Act 1998 3rd March 2015 — Surjit Tour (Monitoring Officer at Wirral Council) gives councillors his opinion at the meeting that he doesn’t think the draft policy banning filming breaches the Human Rights Act 1998 3rd March 2015

Last year I wrote a piece on this blog headlined The day democracy and freedom of the press died at Wirral Council: 28th October 2014 and earlier this week published my email to councillors on the Standards and Constitutional Oversight Committee detailing my concerns about a proposed policy banning filming at public meetings of Wirral Council.

Last night councillors (as you can see from the video above) on Wirral Council’s Standards and Constitutional Oversight Committee agreed to bash the final nail in the coffin of press freedom to report on public meetings of Wirral Council and recommended to all councillors at the next Council meeting on the 16th of March that press freedom remain dead and buried (that is they recommended a draft policy on the reporting of all public meetings of Wirral Council).

Around the time a new law (the Openness of Local Government Bodies Regulations 2014) came into force last August, which prevented local councils stopping filming of their meetings, Eric Pickles was quoted as saying "How can we criticise Putin’s Russia for suppressing freedom of the press when, up and down the land, police are threatening to arrest people for reporting a council meeting with digital media?"

Labour councillors on the Standards and Constitutional Oversight Committee last night repeatedly prevented any discussion by opposition councillors on the controversial subjects of the closure of Lyndale School and library opening hours. If councillors from the ruling group can’t respect and listen to viewpoints they may not agree with, how can democracy actually function at all on Wirral Council?

Despite concerns I expressed at the meeting itself about the lack of consultation and concerns over whether the draft policy breached both section 6(1) of the Human Rights Act 1998 (in respect of Article 10 on freedom of expression) and Regulation 4 of the Openness of Local Government Bodies Regulations 2014, councillors agreed to recommend it to the next Council meeting.

The draft policy (if approved by Council) will mean that at the start of the meeting the Chair will ask anyone if they have any objections to the meeting being filmed. If someone does object the Chair will stop the meeting being filmed. However any legal powers Chairs may have had to stop filming of public meetings were repealed by the Openness of Local Government Bodies Regulations 2014 last year.

The policy goes much further and states a ban on editing filming, photography or recording of a meeting that could cause “reputational harm”.

Wirral Council seem to not recognise the importance of the independence of the press and councillors on the Standards and Constitutional Oversight Committee don’t seem to think there is anything wrong with this policy.

If you’re from the Wirral and would like to make your views known to your local councillors ahead of the Council meeting on the 16th March, their contact details are on this page. As emails to councillors are no routinely filtered, I would suggest phoning or writing by mail.

If you’re have a WordPress blog, please feel free to reblog this post. If you’d like to write about the draft policy it is on Wirral Council’s website and the other papers and reports for the meeting can be found on Wirral Council’s website here. The code to embed the Youtube video of the meeting can be found by visiting Youtube and clicking on share then embed.

You can also give your opinion whether you think this policy is a good idea or not in the poll below:

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11 more pages of Wirral Council councillors' mileage claims (Elderton, Hornby, Kelly, Povall, Salter, H Smith and P Williams)

11 more pages of Wirral Council councillors’ mileage claims (Elderton, Hornby, Kelly, Povall, Salter, H Smith and P Williams)

A long time ago I was up to the travel expenses for Cllr Phil Davies in the extra pages supplied last month that should’ve come in the original tranche in September.

The rests were scanned in, just until now haven’t been uploaded or blogged about. For the sake of convenience, I am just putting the remaining pages below. These aren’t complete for the 2013-14 as many are pages originally missing from those supplied by Wirral Council’s Human Resources department as part of the original request. For the other pages for those councillors you’ll have to look elsewhere on this blog.

These are a further eleven pages that cover Cllrs David Elderton, Mike Hornby, Stuart Kelly, Cherry Povall, John Salter, Harry Smith and Patricia Williams. I may blog about them in detail another time, but at least by publishing the rest of the pages are in the public domain should you wish to view them. Councillors are in alphabetical order by surname. There are multiple pages for some councillors.

There is also a mysterious taxi contract for councillors. I’m still awaiting further details on that and the Mayor and Deputy Mayor’s expenses for 2013-14.

Cllr David Elderton expenses claim 2013 page 1 of 1

Cllr Mike Hornby expenses claim 2013 page 1 of 4

Cllr Mike Hornby expenses claim 2013 page 2 of 4

Cllr Mike Hornby expenses claim 2013 page 3 of 4

Cllr Mike Hornby expenses claim 2013 page 4 of 4

Cllr Stuart Kelly expenses claim 2013 page 1 of 1

Cllr Cherry Povall expenses claim 2014 page 1 of 1

Cllr John Salter expenses claim 2013 page 1 of 1

Cllr Harry Smith expenses claim 2013 page 1 of 2

Cllr Harry Smith expenses claim 2013 page 2 of 2

Cllr Patricia Williams expenses claim 2013 page 1 of 1

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Mark Latham of Wirral Street Pastors tells Wirral’s councillors graphic stories about Birkenhead’s boozy night life

Mark Latham from Wirral Street Pastors told councillors on Wirral Council’s Licensing Act 2003 Committee about his experiences of Birkenhead’s night life and alcohol (19th March 2014)

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The presentation by Wirral Street Pastors starts at 1:39 in the video above.

Councillors on Wirral Council’s Licensing Act 2003 Committee yesterday listened to a brief talk from a Mark Latham of Wirral Street Pastors about what Wirral Street Pastors do on a Friday evening and Saturday morning in Birkenhead. Mr. Latham said that he would give a quick overview of what Wirral Street Pastors do and what they are and hoped from that that the councillors would glean valuable information.

He said that his role as coordinator was to try to develop a better relationship between local government, Wirral Council and the police. So far he had had meetings with the Police and Crime Commissioner for Merseyside (Jane Kennedy), Rt Hon Frank Field MP, Rt Hon Esther McVey MP, Cllr Ian Lewis and Emma Degg (a couple of times). Mr Latham said that these meetings were to bridge the gap between what the Wirral Street Pastors do and what they see.

He explained that street pastors started ten years ago when they saw a need that people in the night-time economy were drinking, being drunk and that there were lots of problems relating to those things such as fighting, antisocial behaviour, violence and crime in general. Mr Latham said that Wirral Street Pastors did the same as what other street pastors across the country did and that they were out on Friday night around Birkenhead patrolling the streets, making sure people were safe and making sure particularly vulnerable individuals got home safely.

The example of a young girl on her own was given and he said that one of his team (which were made up of female and male individuals) would stay with them and either ring their parent or a friend or get them into a taxi to make sure they get home safely. Wirral Street Pastors also gave out free flip-flops to ensure that women who had taken their shoes off don’t stand on broken glass or the general filth that’s on the streets.

In addition to free flip-flops Wirral Street Pastors also give out bottles of water and space blankets to the homeless and people who’d had one too many to drink. The aim of this was to hydrate them so that the taxis would take them. He said that some people were so drunk that taxi drivers refused them rides as the taxi drivers were concerned that these people would throw up in the back of their taxi.

Mr Latham said that the average cost to the National Health Service of a drink related incident was £4,000. He said every pair of flip-flops that they gave out meant that that person wasn’t standing on broken glass requiring an X-ray which would cost the taxpayer money. For every fight that the Wirral Street Pastors had broken up, every antisocial behaviour incident that was simmered down put less of a strain on police resources.

He said that they had a standard operating procedure with the police that allowed Wirral Street Pastors to engage with people allowing the police to concentrate on what they needed to do. Mr Latham said the Wirral Street Pastors dealt with the homeless who they gave space blankets too as well as signposting them to the Wirral Churches Ark Project, ARCH Initiatives and other agencies.

Mark Latham gave an example of somebody having their head stamped on a fortnight ago was given, Wirral Street Pastors stayed with him until the ambulance turned up and that he was fortunate that Wirral Street Pastors had been with him “because he would have been dead within about half an hour” because he was losing consciousness.

He told councillors about another person who was “roaming round”, who was “suffering from mental illness” that the Wirral Street Pastors “got back on his medication” and dealt with his needs. Mr Latham said that most of the time that the Wirral Street Pastors were just there to make sure people are safe and to be a listening ear. He referred to Cllr Ian Lewis coming out with the Wirral Street Pastors recently and that Cllr Ian Lewis could relate his experiences of that to the other councillors on the Licensing Act 2003 Committee. Mr Latham said that the Wirral Street Pastors were engaging with the community, the neighbourhood and the people who were out in the night-time economy. He said that there was much more to it than he had outlined, but he was happy to take questions from councillors.

The first question was from Cllr Harry Smith asking if the Wirral Street Pastors were connected to a church and whether they wore any special gear when they were out at night. Mark Latham replied that they had a uniform that they had to wear which was a DayGlo duotone blue jacket. He said that it was a condition of their insurance that they had to wear these uniforms but also so that they were identifiable and that the police knew who they were. He said that the Wirral Street Pastors are a Christian organisation. He said there were various inter denominational churches across the Wirral that were involved.

Mr Latham said that the Wirral Street Pastors were the only recognised ministry by the police and that the reason why it was recognised was because it wasn’t proclamation, that the Wirral Street Pastors didn’t go out preaching but they were just there to help people. He added that the Wirral Street Pastors were a highly trained group of individuals that had “police training”.

Cllr John Salter asked who the Wirral Street Pastors got funding from? Mark Latham answered that they don’t and that all volunteers paid £300 each to do it. Although it was supported by the Home Office, their standard operating procedures were “signed off by Scotland Yard and the Home Office” that that was the entirety of their involvement. He said that the national statistics were fed back regularly to David Cameron, but that the only funding they got was what they received from individuals as well as grants from Christian organisations.

Cllr Andrew Hodson asked how many Wirral Street Pastors there were in total and how many were out on the streets? Mark Latham answered that there were fifteen. He said that they went out every Friday night in teams of four (two men and two women) starting at half past ten at Charing Cross and finish at four.

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Planning Committee (Wirral Council) 3rd January 2011 Part 4 APP/11/01050 – Manor Place, Bromborough, Wirral, CH62 4TU This application is for a development of 40 new affordable houses, in Bromborough Pool Village. The new houses are 2 storey, three bed five person houses, which meet modern standards such as the Code for Sustainable Homes Level 3

Matthew introduced item 7 (APP/11/01050) – Manor Place, Bromborough, Wirral, CH62 4TU. This was for forty affordable homes two stories high. The planning application covered four sites, site 1 (land to the South of the Green), site 2 (a former allotment site on Manor Place), site 3 (land on Manor Place) and site 4 (land on York Street). The last site was partly allocated in the Unitary Development Plan. There was enough highway capacity for the extra traffic that would result and the design incorporated off street parking.

He said that this would allow a departure from the Unitary Development Plan subject to conditions to do with boundary treatment, a ground contamination survey and an extra condition that was material and specified on the late list.

The Chair asked if members of the committee had any comments?

Cllr John Salter asked (in reference to page 32 item 6) would the mature trees that would be removed put back or replaced with new trees? How would they keep a check to see the trees had been replaced?

Matthew replied that the application had been amended to remove the turning head, which would now not take place. York Street had been improved with significant tree planting planned and that was the reason behind the condition.

The Chair referred them to the top of page 33. Councillor Peter Johnson proposed approval.

There was a vote:

For: Cllrs Elderton, Clements, Boult, Johnson, Kenny, Salter, Realey, Mooney, Walsh, Kelly and Mitchell (11)
Against: 0 (None)
Abstention: 0 (None)

Application APP/11/01050 was approved with conditions (11:0:0)

Labour councillor bans filming at public meeting to decide whether to licence a taxi that’s over 10 years old

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Why are Wirral councillors trying to kill off press freedom by a new public meetings filming ban?

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11 more pages of Wirral Council councillors’ mileage claims (Elderton, Hornby, Kelly, Povall, Salter, H Smith and P Williams)

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Mark Latham of Wirral Street Pastors tells Wirral’s councillors graphic stories about Birkenhead’s boozy night life

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